Large earth elemental

[moritheil]

I had a large earth elemental fighting a group of PCs in a cave. At one point, the elemental sank into the earth and wandered off. He reappeared later as a face on the cave wall, which the PCs ignored. At some point thereafter, he attacked a PC. He had 10' reach and hit decently hard, so rather than close for combat, the PCs decided to back away.

My question is this: while he was "sitting in the wall" partly merged with the rock, should he have cover relative to the party? Should they have cover relative to him? What about concealment? What would you use, if anything, to account for the fact that most of him is not attackable due to being merged with the rock?

I flavor texted it as his arms suddenly shooting out from the cavern floor to pummel people in the kneecaps and groin, and then sinking back into the rock.

EDIT: Thanks to Len and Inf pointing this out; I forgot to mention it. Earths, IMC, have tremorsense. But I'm also interested in what the rules would say if they did not.

 

[Infiniti2000]

The elemental would have full cover from the party's attacks while the party would not gain any cover at all. Unfortunately, being completely submerged in stone, the elemental would effectively be blind (because he doesn't have tremorsense). So, you can let the elemental engage in that tactic, but he can't see. If he's out of the rock (IMO by half his Space), then he would have normal cover and not be blind.

 

[Len]

If there aren't any rules for this (I can't find any) then you could use the rules for incorporeal creatures that are inside walls:

[It can sense the presence of creatures or objects within a square adjacent to its current location], but enemies have total concealment (50% miss chance) from an incorporeal creature that is inside an object. In order to see farther from the object it is in and attack normally, the incorporeal creature must emerge. An incorporeal creature inside an object has total cover, but when it attacks a creature outside the object it only has cover, so a creature outside with a readied action could strike at it as it attacks.

The part about "sense the presence of creatures or objects within a square adjacent to its current location" doesn't apply to earth elementals. The rest makes sense in your situation.

(Although it is a bit strange that earth elementals have no way of sensing their surroundings when they're in earth. They must spend most of their time in the ground. How do they get around if they're completely blind?)

 

[Infiniti2000]

(Although it is a bit strange that earth elementals have no way of sensing their surroundings when they're in earth. They must spend most of their time in the ground. How do they get around if they're completely blind?)

Usually by houseruling that earth elementals have tremorsense.

 

[moritheil]

If there aren't any rules for this (I can't find any) then you could use the rules for incorporeal creatures that are inside walls:

The part about "sense the presence of creatures or objects within a square adjacent to its current location" doesn't apply to earth elementals. The rest makes sense in your situation.

(Although it is a bit strange that earth elementals have no way of sensing their surroundings when they're in earth. They must spend most of their time in the ground. How do they get around if they're completely blind?)

IMC earths have tremorsense, because otherwise they are effectively blind all the time on the plane of earth, which seems intensely and mind-bogglingly stupid.

And I had the earth's face showing on the cavern wall (he stuck his face out to see), but not the rest of it. I don't know if that changes anything.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Does the wall (for all intents and purposes) end between two squares on the grid? If so, it's a little weird to have the LEE stick his face into the neighboring grid. In any case, he has full cover and cannot be attacked. His limbs cannot be attacked, so the party can't even ready to attack him when he attacks. Because of the tremorsense, the LEE gets no minuses to attack (assuming it's target is touching the ground), just a 50% concealment.

If you want to say, however, that the LEE is actually emerging from the wall/floor, treat it as regular cover (+4 to AC), with no concealment. I would similarly houserule that for the LEE to move from full cover to normal cover would be a 5ft-step (i.e. once per round).

 

[moritheil]

Does the wall (for all intents and purposes) end between two squares on the grid? If so, it's a little weird to have the LEE stick his face into the neighboring grid. In any case, he has full cover and cannot be attacked. His limbs cannot be attacked, so the party can't even ready to attack him when he attacks. Because of the tremorsense, the LEE gets no minuses to attack (assuming it's target is touching the ground), just a 50% concealment.

If you want to say, however, that the LEE is actually emerging from the wall/floor, treat it as regular cover (+4 to AC), with no concealment. I would similarly houserule that for the LEE to move from full cover to normal cover would be a 5ft-step (i.e. once per round).

Interesting. The LEE's options are either a bit of blind thrusting at the party while totally safe, or simply having a bit of an AC bonus. For the scenario, I actually gave it regular cover, with the +4 to AC you mentioned resulting in an AC22.

What I was curious about is whether or not the group gets cover relative to the elemental, but I see that that is neatly handled by saying that if the elemental is fully submerged the group is 50% concealed, and if not, the group has no cover whatsoever. I guess I'm too used to thinking that if someone has cover relative to you, you should have cover relative to them.

Just as a side note, I ruled that this encounter was more difficult than its CR suggested, and increased the exp awarded to the party by about 30%.

Thanks!

 

[Philip]

Interesting. The LEE's options are either a bit of blind thrusting at the party while totally safe, or simply having a bit of an AC bonus. For the scenario, I actually gave it regular cover, with the +4 to AC you mentioned resulting in an AC22.

Which begs the question: why don't earth elementals always attack from cover? The occasions that earth elementals are not in contact with some kind of solid material they can move through are pretty rare....

(Earth Elementals have tremorsense in my campaign too)

 

[Whimsical]

Moretheil, what you may be looking for is improved cover.

From the System Reference Document:

COVER

Varying Degrees of Cover: In some cases, cover may provide a greater bonus to AC and Reflex saves. In such situations the normal cover bonuses to AC and Reflex saves can be doubled (to +8 and +4, respectively). A creature with this improved cover effectively gains improved evasion against any attack to which the Reflex save bonus applies. Furthermore, improved cover provides a +10 bonus on Hide checks.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

Which begs the question: why don't earth elementals always attack from cover? The occasions that earth elementals are not in contact with some kind of solid material they can move through are pretty rare....

(Earth Elementals have tremorsense in my campaign too)

I don't have my MM in front of me but maybe they're not intelligent enough to use such tactics.