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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Helldritch" data-source="post: 6966563" data-attributes="member: 6855114">[MENTION=5834]Celtavian[/MENTION]Again you assume optimal positioning for the players and put the "dumbness of dumbness" in the orcs. We do not take space into account simply because we are using the lord of the ring scenario. You keep putting the PCs in a good limelight whereas they were not aware of the horde. They are exploring an unknown vast and I mean very vast room where hundreds could stand with many many many openings. Stop putting your PCs out of the situation to put them in a good tactical encounter where they can win easily.The whole point of this situation is to point out that contrary to other editions, the orcs would stand a real threatening chance to win that encounter with the PCs. We have already conceded that in some scenarios the PC could and would win. You only take these into account and blatantly ignore what we are saying. Take time to think about it and you will see that the possibility of failing for the PCs in that scenario is real.OB1 did a white room math and proved that the PC would be in way over their heads and he was only using standard orcs. I said a horde. That means clerics and orogs and everything that orcs can bring about. And they will not hesitate to put flaming oil on the ground putting concentration spells at risk and doing auto damage every round. Even a DC 10 with advantage can be failed. With 3 to 5 silence spells in the middle of the players, no more spells for your PCs. They would simply be toast.One thing I will give you is that doing the 300 or the 10,000 orcs fight would be boooooring to the extreme. All one sided battles are.</blockquote>

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