Learning the rules as we play - various questions

[Mercurius]

Hi all,
So my group justed started playing last Saturday; we originally planned on being a once-a-month affair, but I'm thinking (hoping) we'll be able to pull it off twice-monthy. Anyway, I'm DMing and haven't played for about six years; everyone else hasn't played since the 90s or even 80s (we're all 30-somethings). I have a general sense of the 4ed rules, but there are a lot of details that I don't understand yet. I figured that we would learn as we played and that hopefully after a few sessions things would be running smoothly. After the first session, in which we ran two combats, a couple things came up:

1) Attack powers - A lot of attack powers seem to use other ability scores as their base rather than, say, STR for melee weapons. With something like Bolstering Strike, does the PC still get Prof bonuses or is it just d20 + CHA + 1/2 level?

2) Multiple attacks - I'm still not certain how these work; the rogue in my group likes to fight with a shortsword and dagger but I haven't checked if he has a feat to accomplish this.

3) Flaming Sphere spell - Does this effectively work like a weapon attack? That is, the wizard casts it and rolls an INT attack vs. Reflex, and then can sustain it and attack again with it the next round? Or the ball can just hang out if the wizard wants to cast something else, and then the wizard could use it later in the encounter?

I'm sure there will be more questions, but that is what comes to mind.

 

[malraux]

1> You get to add the weapon prof bonus to attack powers with the weapon keyword.

2> You don't normally get multiple attacks. You only get one standard action per turn, and it takes a standard action to make an attack. (edit: you can hold two melee weapons, but one has to have the off hand property, which daggers do. So its ok for the rogue to have both, but each round he has to choose which he uses.)

3> Look at the sustain effect to know how to keep something going.

Sustain Minor: You can sustain this power until the end of the encounter. As a standard action, you can make another attack with the sphere.

So the wizard needs to spend a minor every turn to keep the sphere around; if he wants to attack again he needs to spend a standard as well.

 

[Nail]

Hi all,
So my group justed started playing last Saturday;

Welcome to 4e!

1) Attack powers - A lot of attack powers seem to use other ability scores as their base rather than, say, STR for melee weapons. With something like Bolstering Strike, does the PC still get Prof bonuses or is it just d20 + CHA + 1/2 level?

In 4e, all classes have attack powers, and each class has certain ability scores tied to those powers. It actually makes a great deal of sense: Wizard spells attack with Int, Fighter melee exploits attack with Strength. Some classes have their choice of ability scores to use (Warlocks use Con for some powers and Chr for others).

If a power has "Weapon" as a keyword, then you DO use the proficiency bonus for that attack power. If a power does not have that keyword, then don't use the weapon priciency bonus. Same for weapon enhancement bonus.

2) Multiple attacks - I'm still not certain how these work; the rogue in my group likes to fight with a shortsword and dagger but I haven't checked if he has a feat to accomplish this.

This is not "feat driven" any more. The power will tell you if you can use your secondary weapon to strike as well. See the ranger power "twin strike" as an example.

3) Flaming Sphere spell - Does this effectively work like a weapon attack? That is, the wizard casts it and rolls an INT attack vs. Reflex, and then can sustain it and attack again with it the next round? Or the ball can just hang out if the wizard wants to cast something else, and then the wizard could use it later in the encounter?

Yes, it's like a weapon attack (tho' no proficiency bonus!).

The wizard can sustain it next round and attack again. He needs to sustain it each round (spend a minor action), even if he doesn't use it to attack that round. After the encounter ends, the Flaming Sphere goes away...he can not sustain it after the encounter is over.

 

[Mercurius]

Thanks malraux and Nail--questions answered! Stay tuned for more

 

[Prism]

As the rogue goes up levels he might want to consider the multiclass feats to allow him to pick a couple of ranger two weapon powers. Although he still only gets the one sneak it can add some nice flavour

 

[DracoSuave]

As the rogue goes up levels he might want to consider the multiclass feats to allow him to pick a couple of ranger two weapon powers. Although he still only gets the one sneak it can add some nice flavour

Aye. First level he can take the multiclass feat into ranger to get Hunter's Quarry/encounter (which is good in the hands of a rogue) and then at level four he can pick up an Encounter Power that'll give him a double weapon strike. If he -really- likes the two-weapon attacks but wants to stay a rogue he can then go from there and take the multiclass paragon path as a ranger and acquire the twin strike at-will.

I don't have Martial Power yet, so I can't comment on how to do this through the Fighter multiclass going into the tempest powers.

 

[Ibixat]

Aye. First level he can take the multiclass feat into ranger to get Hunter's Quarry/encounter (which is good in the hands of a rogue) and then at level four he can pick up an Encounter Power that'll give him a double weapon strike. If he -really- likes the two-weapon attacks but wants to stay a rogue he can then go from there and take the multiclass paragon path as a ranger and acquire the twin strike at-will.

I don't have Martial Power yet, so I can't comment on how to do this through the Fighter multiclass going into the tempest powers.

Twin strike would be pretty nice to help make sure you don't miss out on a round of sneak attack damage. Never thought of that before.

 

[DracoSuave]

Not to mention, Hunter's Quarry is like another round worth of Sneak Attack damage to that target, which is smexy.

 

[Nail]

Not to mention, Hunter's Quarry is like another round worth of Sneak Attack damage to that target, which is smexy.

...well, half of the Sneak Attack damage, and only once per encounter. That's not all that good, actually. The extra skill from the ranger multiclass isn't all that good either, for a rogue.

I'm not convinced multi-classing to a ranger is a good idea for a rogue, at least not until higher levels.

 

[DracoSuave]

...well, half of the Sneak Attack damage, and only once per encounter. That's not all that good, actually. The extra skill from the ranger multiclass isn't all that good either, for a rogue.

I'm not convinced multi-classing to a ranger is a good idea for a rogue, at least not until higher levels.

It lasts until the end of the next round, so you get two rounds worth of it.

2X1d6=2d6 which is what sneak attack does at heroic levels.