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Message: <blockquote data-quote="SkyCAM" data-source="post: 5761806" data-attributes="member: 6686348">I really loved the idea that legacy weapons gave the players sort of minor artifacts early in the game and that they could harnish their abilities over their natural progression. We played the Yuan-Ti adventure path and there were plenty of nice legacy weapons in there which i substituted for other legacy items if I saw it fit. The big difference to relic items for me is, that the players got very nice abilities but none of them seamed out of proportion. That is one of the reasons I'm troubled as a master to hand out (even minor) artifacts. Artifacts or relic items have almost no major game impact at a later point of a high level campaign since the players are way to strong. For me playing a arcane caster myself a lot the main reason I want an artifact for is to get sort of "immune" to Mordenkainen's Disjunction.But looking at a particular item from the Sinister Spire adventure there is a staff called Banrhialorg in there. Very cool for a wizard to have but at the applied penalties? I think not. Completing all rituals costs the player 60,500 GP. Plus -2 CL, -1 skill checks, -2  spell save and a hefty spell slot level loss (up to 8th). Seriously no wizard would except those penalties when he can have all the abilities from other items costing about as much or from spells he can cast.I just picked up the copy of the adventure and read throug the text. As for your initial question it seems to depend on the item if the penalties are cumulative or not. The text for the staff reads as follows:"For Banrhialorg, the penalties are not cumulative. Each penalty replaces ones that came before it"Again I loved the idea of the rituals because they give the player the chance to develop their characters. Getting the required information about the legacy of the item can be an adventure in itself. If you think the item's powers are to strong for the group I'd just at least try to balance them out a bit. CL penalty for a wizard is an absolute no go for example if you ask me.</blockquote>

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