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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Someone" data-source="post: 5756327" data-attributes="member: 5656">Literature in general is hard to reconcile with what happens at the table. Anyway, it's true that Orpheus as described enters the realm of epic, but what I tried to add to the conversation is, how much as a supernatural thing did ancient greeks or romans saw that tale? It was like a fairy tale, or like John McClane crashing a car into a helicopter? We can roll our eyes at the shenanigans in Die Hard, but usually we don't think that McCalne did cast a Crash Car Into Helicopter spell, just made a stupidly high Drive check.Some cultures think everything has a spirit. If rocks and sticks have spirits then is conceivable that a nonmagical song can move them to tears, even if the singer has to perform extremely well to reach a literally rock hard heart. In such a world, insulting skeletons to death is plausible; in the settings built around the 2e-3e framework that most people is used to, where nonmagical abilities normally were enhanced versions of real world abilities, that skill is absurd. These settings have also the advantage of being easily explainable as "like our world, just with wizards and dragons", while the 4e default is more complex, but in my opinion not less valid.</blockquote>