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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 5496040" data-attributes="member: 82106">I think the problem is it is way to simplistic to say there is 'complexity'. There are really various different dimensions to an RPG and it could be more or less complex in different ways, and the complexity could be experienced at different levels depending on choices the player makes.On top of that I am not at all convinced that RPGs inevitably evolve to be more complex either. There are plenty of examples of newer and more simple RPGs replacing more complex ones. There are examples of games which started out monstrously complex (Rollmaster anyone). I think the better way to look at it is diffusion. The game started in 1974 at a specific point (which was admittedly simpler on most levels than modern D&D). From there it moved off in different directions catering to different tastes. Basic D&D retained the original level of complexity and even cut it back in some ways. AD&D added complexity. 2e simplified some things and made many of the more complex things options. 3e streamlined a lot of the rules, but added new complicated things, etc. Notice that while the official D&D products generally drifted in the direction of greater complexity there were also movements in the other direction as well. Many OSR type systems are as simple as Basic, sometimes even more so. There are d20 variations which are extremely stripped down as well. On top of that I don't think you can take D&D entirely in isolation here. Lots of gamers simply moved off to other simpler systems, at least for part of their RPGing needs. In other words 1e -> 2e -> 3e -> 3.5e -> 4e is the main direction taken by TSR/WotC in which the game has generally grown more complex with a pruning back and reformulation now and then to make greater options etc more manageable but generally at least reaching a plateau of complexity with late 2e and arguably somewhat increasing after that. The audience for this game is obviously the people whom that was satisfactory to. That doesn't mean complexity always grows or that it is somehow a desirable end in and of itself.Personally I like the FLEXIBILITY of 4e and the generality and modularity of its rules. That doesn't mean I endorse all of the other baggage that has been lumped onto that train. Mearls' article lacks sufficient depth of analysis to capture those distinctions and his poll is pretty much useless as the options need to be more diverse and specific. For instance I don't mind a lot of choices existing in character building, as long as building an individual character doesn't require mastering a lot of different factors and the options can be reasonable sorted and accessed. OTOH large amounts of complexity in choosing options in play at the table and in tracking effects and such is undesirable.</blockquote>

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