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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 6279041" data-attributes="member: 22779">I was assuming that Grazz't would be in the Monster Manual and not relagated to another book.&nbsp; If they are bringing in proper nouns into the MM without even having those proper nouns IN the book, I would be dead set against that.&nbsp; I have no problem with Orcus being the lord of undead so long as Orcus is actually in the MM.&nbsp; Asmodeus is the lord of Hell?&nbsp; Cool.&nbsp; So long as I can turn to the right page and see who this Asmodeus guy is.&nbsp; But, as soon as you start referencing elements that aren't included in the book, now it's just an advertisement to buy that setting guide.&nbsp; &quot;Hey, Aarococra are like this in Athas.&quot;&nbsp; Well, what's an Athas and why should I care?Now, let's not get too carried away though.&nbsp; I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that a new player might know real world mythologies.&nbsp; If you reference Greek Myths with a centaur (something D&amp;D hasn't actually ever done) it's not a huge stretch to think that someone might know what those myths are.&nbsp; But, I certainly wouldn't presume that anyone who hasn't been a D&amp;D fan for a long time would know what a Domain of Dread, Krynn or Lady of Pain are.&nbsp;Yeah, KM pegged me right on this one.&nbsp; I loathed 2e for this.&nbsp; And, yup, I had to take a big old black marker and redact swaths of the MM every time I ran a campaign for a new player.&nbsp; It was sooooo annoying.&nbsp; And, because 2e tried to shoehorn everything into the same universe, I constantly had players asking to play (Setting specific class/race) in my campaign, because, &quot;Well, the rules say that everything is in one universe and accessible from everywhere else.&nbsp; What's wrong with your game?&quot;I'd much, much rather that the core game focused on a fairly generic overview of the races - tying them to elements within the same book is fine - and keep all the setting specific stuff contained to that setting.&nbsp; Stop trying to shoehorn everything together.&nbsp; It never works for one thing - the cosmologies are just too different.&nbsp;&nbsp; And the balancing elements don't export either.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 6279041, member: 22779"] I was assuming that Grazz't would be in the Monster Manual and not relagated to another book. If they are bringing in proper nouns into the MM without even having those proper nouns IN the book, I would be dead set against that. I have no problem with Orcus being the lord of undead so long as Orcus is actually in the MM. Asmodeus is the lord of Hell? Cool. So long as I can turn to the right page and see who this Asmodeus guy is. But, as soon as you start referencing elements that aren't included in the book, now it's just an advertisement to buy that setting guide. "Hey, Aarococra are like this in Athas." Well, what's an Athas and why should I care? Now, let's not get too carried away though. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to think that a new player might know real world mythologies. If you reference Greek Myths with a centaur (something D&D hasn't actually ever done) it's not a huge stretch to think that someone might know what those myths are. But, I certainly wouldn't presume that anyone who hasn't been a D&D fan for a long time would know what a Domain of Dread, Krynn or Lady of Pain are. Yeah, KM pegged me right on this one. I loathed 2e for this. And, yup, I had to take a big old black marker and redact swaths of the MM every time I ran a campaign for a new player. It was sooooo annoying. And, because 2e tried to shoehorn everything into the same universe, I constantly had players asking to play (Setting specific class/race) in my campaign, because, "Well, the rules say that everything is in one universe and accessible from everywhere else. What's wrong with your game?" I'd much, much rather that the core game focused on a fairly generic overview of the races - tying them to elements within the same book is fine - and keep all the setting specific stuff contained to that setting. Stop trying to shoehorn everything together. It never works for one thing - the cosmologies are just too different. And the balancing elements don't export either. [/QUOTE]

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