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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ratskinner" data-source="post: 6161439" data-attributes="member: 6688937">Yes, although you may not represent precisely the people I was talking about, given what else you wrote.I simply don't know what suspension of disbelief has to do with what I was talking about.The DM's narrative will be beholden to game design (to some extent) regardless of what that game design is. Even old-school versions of D&D had scene framing, they just didn't acknowledge it as such (which is not surprising, given the context as "first in the field"). Many of the older versions had specific rules for specific types of scenes: exploration rules and doing things in "turns", combat rules and doing things in rounds, etc. In the Interaction "pillar" and I would say the unrecognized "trap" scene, those rules tended to be much less formal, and its never explicit that you are framing scenes (at least, I don't recall any such wording until at least 2e, where I think such language was used in a "you can think of it this way" example of designing encounters for DMs...maybe). In any case, there's plenty of old-school adventuring where "You enter a room that is [room description] there are [#] orcs here, roll initiative" is perfectly acceptable scene-framing. ermm....can't say I'm sure how sceneframing techniques directly affect setting per se. I think you may be reacting to something other than what I meant.There are certain playstyles, mostly within what some folks call  "old-school", where the narrative (especially story) aspects of play are  very thin or superficial, and the heart of play lies within the players  overcoming the challenge of getting their characters through a  difficult dungeon or other challenge without character death. Within that sphere there are folks for whom my characterization represents their desired playstyle quite accurately. On occasion I've played with them. There's nothing particularly wrong with that playstyle vs. any other.However, it does present you with a game design quandry when it comes to selecting a sceneframing technique for a game like 5e which is attempting to satisfy players of multiple playstyles. Those players do not represent a vanishingly small fraction of the target playerbase for 5e, therefore they shouldn't be ignored. Conventional wisdom is that its easier for more story-oriented players to handle games that don't cater directly to their playstyle (some would debate this), therefore 5e is unlikely (IMO) to feature story-oriented mechanics (like formal scene-framing) that those old-schoolers would object to. I don't find that objectionable at all.</blockquote>

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