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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 6253218" data-attributes="member: 7006">Exactly.&nbsp; Everything has grown organically over time, and yet we still do the things we should have grown out of decades ago because the reasons are no longer valid or overdone.The very original game was &quot;explore this dungeon, killing monsters, disarming traps etc. etc.&quot;.&nbsp; At the time people did that... it was all new.&nbsp; And there was no standardized protocol on how to accomplish it.&nbsp; But the more any of us played the game, and the more we saw the same tropes appearing over and over in every dungeon... the more we realized that there was the same mechanical functions that had to occur each and every time to defeat them.&nbsp; Thus... the origination of &quot;tapping the ground in front of us with a 10 foot pole.&quot;At some point... several years into the process... we needed to just stop putting f-ing trap doors in random hallways in our dungeons.&nbsp; Because we all knew they were there, we all knew how to get past them, it was just a matter of wasting time trying to find the &quot;right&quot; square on the map that it was hidden.The trap was no longer a thing to surprise us or keep us alert or let us accomplish something &quot;cool&quot;.&nbsp; Instead, it was just an artificial way to slow the party down.&nbsp; The truest definition of &quot;jumping through hoops&quot;.&nbsp; Most traps in fact I don't believe actually add to game play AT ALL.&nbsp; And the only ones that do?&nbsp; The ones we've never experienced before and thus have no regular checklist on how to defeat them.Use those kinds of traps.&nbsp; Original ones.&nbsp; Ones that don't require a &quot;passive perception&quot; check to be made so as to avoid the party arbitrarily stumbling into it.&nbsp; Either make it so that you're supposed to stumble into it, or make it so that just because you can see it... you still need the player to explain how they're doing something into order to disarm it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 6253218, member: 7006"] Exactly. Everything has grown organically over time, and yet we still do the things we should have grown out of decades ago because the reasons are no longer valid or overdone. The very original game was "explore this dungeon, killing monsters, disarming traps etc. etc.". At the time people did that... it was all new. And there was no standardized protocol on how to accomplish it. But the more any of us played the game, and the more we saw the same tropes appearing over and over in every dungeon... the more we realized that there was the same mechanical functions that had to occur each and every time to defeat them. Thus... the origination of "tapping the ground in front of us with a 10 foot pole." At some point... several years into the process... we needed to just stop putting f-ing trap doors in random hallways in our dungeons. Because we all knew they were there, we all knew how to get past them, it was just a matter of wasting time trying to find the "right" square on the map that it was hidden. The trap was no longer a thing to surprise us or keep us alert or let us accomplish something "cool". Instead, it was just an artificial way to slow the party down. The truest definition of "jumping through hoops". Most traps in fact I don't believe actually add to game play AT ALL. And the only ones that do? The ones we've never experienced before and thus have no regular checklist on how to defeat them. Use those kinds of traps. Original ones. Ones that don't require a "passive perception" check to be made so as to avoid the party arbitrarily stumbling into it. Either make it so that you're [I]supposed[/I] to stumble into it, or make it so that just because you can see it... you still need the player to explain how they're doing something into order to disarm it. [/QUOTE]

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