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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 6194758" data-attributes="member: 2525">We disagree about what class groups are.  They do relate to the actual kind of character you're playing, and if they don't, you should be picking a different class.  All rogues, regardless of your actual character, have a number of abilities which allow them to see how to use stealth better than others.  It's right there in the class description, "Rogues use skill, stealth, and their foes’ vulnerabilities to get the upper hand." It's implied by their ability to sneak attack and cunning action.  This is a core concept to all rogues.Now you can not like that, and not want that for your character.  In which case, I suggest you choose a different class, or a different game.First, this begs the question as to why he wants the cloak of stealth.  But second, that doesn't mean he is incapable of understanding how to benefit better from a stealth item than others.  As you said, this guy tries to not be stealthy, so he understands what is and is not stealthy better than someone who doesn't think about that issue much at all.They're not arbitrary.  They have to lock down SOME concepts for classes or else it becomes a class-less system.  So they're going to pick some things you're class is better at than others.  Which, again, is why I think you want a class-less system but you're saying you don't.  OK, then accept that a class-based system inherently will make each class better at some things than others, regardless of how you want to play that class, unless you multi-class enough to embrace your personal concept in a mish-mash of classes.People have named half a dozen in this thread at this point, and you've either hand-waived or ignored most of them.  Why should I go back and gather than information just for you to hand-waive it some more? Demonstrate to me you have an open mind on this issue and I can do that, but right now the language you're using seems pretty firmly in the "I've made up my mind and no matter what you say I see no use in this bad thing".</blockquote>

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