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Legends & Lore: Skills
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<blockquote data-quote="KidSnide" data-source="post: 5585247" data-attributes="member: 54710"><p>This system does have the advantage of narrative coherence, although it directs the player's skill into narrating actions consistent with the dice. I like this sort of approach for when there is no in-game detail for the players to analyze. E.g. when the players are trying to traverse a swamp, I don't have a swamp map for the players to analyze, so it makes sense to use a die roll as the sole determiner of the character's effectiveness. Similarly, if the PCs are trying to intimidate a random guard patrol, the roleplaying is going to be some sort of generic display of bravado. I feel the same way about searching for treasure in dungeons.</p><p></p><p>In contrast, when the PCs are trying to persuade a fully developed NPC, that character's motivations, loyalties are quirks are things that the players actually have information about. Reducing interaction with that character to a die roll seems like it loses a great opportunity. Instead, I want the players to think about what sorts of arguments that NPC would find persuasive, and I want to provide major adjustments (or auto-successes) to reflect that player consideration of the game world. Similarly, if I'm running a detective mystery, it's important for the players to think about where to find clues. There I take an old school approach by deciding where the clues are actually hidden. Each time the PCs make a search check, they need to say where they are looking, and looking in the right place provides a major bonus (or auto-success).</p><p></p><p>To me, the roll-first vs. roll-second question depends on whether the players have enough information to meaningfully interact with the game world. Obviously, this means that roll-first tends to happen with less important rolls (which tend to involve less detailed aspects of the game world), while the players have to think carefully (and roll-second) when there is detail to analyze.</p><p></p><p>Obviously, the "correct" technique for handling skills is significantly group and game dependent. However, I think 4e deserves a bit of criticism for it's one-size-fits-all design philosophy. YMMV.</p><p></p><p>-KS</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="KidSnide, post: 5585247, member: 54710"] This system does have the advantage of narrative coherence, although it directs the player's skill into narrating actions consistent with the dice. I like this sort of approach for when there is no in-game detail for the players to analyze. E.g. when the players are trying to traverse a swamp, I don't have a swamp map for the players to analyze, so it makes sense to use a die roll as the sole determiner of the character's effectiveness. Similarly, if the PCs are trying to intimidate a random guard patrol, the roleplaying is going to be some sort of generic display of bravado. I feel the same way about searching for treasure in dungeons. In contrast, when the PCs are trying to persuade a fully developed NPC, that character's motivations, loyalties are quirks are things that the players actually have information about. Reducing interaction with that character to a die roll seems like it loses a great opportunity. Instead, I want the players to think about what sorts of arguments that NPC would find persuasive, and I want to provide major adjustments (or auto-successes) to reflect that player consideration of the game world. Similarly, if I'm running a detective mystery, it's important for the players to think about where to find clues. There I take an old school approach by deciding where the clues are actually hidden. Each time the PCs make a search check, they need to say where they are looking, and looking in the right place provides a major bonus (or auto-success). To me, the roll-first vs. roll-second question depends on whether the players have enough information to meaningfully interact with the game world. Obviously, this means that roll-first tends to happen with less important rolls (which tend to involve less detailed aspects of the game world), while the players have to think carefully (and roll-second) when there is detail to analyze. Obviously, the "correct" technique for handling skills is significantly group and game dependent. However, I think 4e deserves a bit of criticism for it's one-size-fits-all design philosophy. YMMV. -KS [/QUOTE]
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