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<blockquote data-quote="Cadfan" data-source="post: 4016206" data-attributes="member: 40961">I wouldn't automatically make these assumptions.First, while its a 26th level monster, you can't compare it to a CR 26 monster.&nbsp; Level and CR are NOT the same between editions.&nbsp; A 26 CR monster was supposed to be an adequate fight, alone, for a party of 4 PCs. Simple enough.But 4e uses an opponent slot kind of system, where you have a number of monster slots about equal to the number of party members.&nbsp; Some monsters use up multiple slots (a &quot;solo,&quot; like a dragon, is 5).&nbsp; An elite monster, which includes the Pit Fiend, uses up two slots.&nbsp; This means that in a fight, your standard 4e party of five characters is NOT facing just one pit fiend.&nbsp; It is facing maybe two pit fiends, and a regular 26th level monster.In addition, there are different types of melee monsters.&nbsp; One type is the &quot;soldier&quot; type, which we have been told covers monsters that are tactical and durable, rather than brutal and highly damaging.&nbsp; The Pit Fiend is a soldier monster.&nbsp; It has a whole lot of hit points, and some very high defenses.&nbsp; This fits its combat role.Finally, the pit fiend's damage isn't all that low.&nbsp; Imagine a fight with two pit fiends, and some unknown ally, versus 5 PCs.&nbsp; First, both pit fiends are doing an automatic 15 damage per round per pit fiend to everyone within 25 feet.&nbsp; Lets assume they do a reasonably good job of boxing everyone in- that means up to about 30 damage per round per character, automatically.&nbsp; Or 150 damage per round, BEFORE they attack.They also penalize armor class, and summon mook enemies.&nbsp; The mook enemies probably aren't so tough (though we haven't seen their stats), but against a foe with a penalized AC, they probably add up.&nbsp; There are a lot of them, after all.Meanwhile, the pit fiends have attacks that not only do damage on impact, they create ongoing damage effects.&nbsp; A smart pit fiend is going to hit one character, leave them poisoned and on fire, then move on to the next character.&nbsp; This makes the damage add up pretty quickly.&nbsp; And the pit fiend's high AC and hit points, plus its ability to summon allies to absorb damage for it, mean that the fight will likely go on for quite a while.Anyways, I don't know how much healing a level 26 cleric can toss out.&nbsp; But its going to be near 150 points per round to handle the aura effects of the pit fiend alone.And of course the two pit fiends still have an ally, who benefits from the pit fiend's aura of fear, and who can add to the encounter.I'm sure the pit fiend will be able to handle himself.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Cadfan, post: 4016206, member: 40961"] I wouldn't automatically make these assumptions. First, while its a 26th level monster, you can't compare it to a CR 26 monster. Level and CR are NOT the same between editions. A 26 CR monster was supposed to be an adequate fight, alone, for a party of 4 PCs. Simple enough. But 4e uses an opponent slot kind of system, where you have a number of monster slots about equal to the number of party members. Some monsters use up multiple slots (a "solo," like a dragon, is 5). An elite monster, which includes the Pit Fiend, uses up two slots. This means that in a fight, your standard 4e party of five characters is NOT facing just one pit fiend. It is facing maybe two pit fiends, and a regular 26th level monster. In addition, there are different types of melee monsters. One type is the "soldier" type, which we have been told covers monsters that are tactical and durable, rather than brutal and highly damaging. The Pit Fiend is a soldier monster. It has a whole lot of hit points, and some very high defenses. This fits its combat role. Finally, the pit fiend's damage isn't all that low. Imagine a fight with two pit fiends, and some unknown ally, versus 5 PCs. First, both pit fiends are doing an automatic 15 damage per round per pit fiend to everyone within 25 feet. Lets assume they do a reasonably good job of boxing everyone in- that means up to about 30 damage per round per character, automatically. Or 150 damage per round, BEFORE they attack. They also penalize armor class, and summon mook enemies. The mook enemies probably aren't so tough (though we haven't seen their stats), but against a foe with a penalized AC, they probably add up. There are a lot of them, after all. Meanwhile, the pit fiends have attacks that not only do damage on impact, they create ongoing damage effects. A smart pit fiend is going to hit one character, leave them poisoned and on fire, then move on to the next character. This makes the damage add up pretty quickly. And the pit fiend's high AC and hit points, plus its ability to summon allies to absorb damage for it, mean that the fight will likely go on for quite a while. Anyways, I don't know how much healing a level 26 cleric can toss out. But its going to be near 150 points per round to handle the aura effects of the pit fiend alone. And of course the two pit fiends still have an ally, who benefits from the pit fiend's aura of fear, and who can add to the encounter. I'm sure the pit fiend will be able to handle himself. [/QUOTE]

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