Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Let’s Compare: Many Different Monster Manuals
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="dd.stevenson" data-source="post: 6272702" data-attributes="member: 6683099"><p><span style="font-size: 15px"><a href="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/excerpts/excerpt_mm2.pdf" target="_blank">D&D 1st Edition Beholder</a></span></p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px">Have I Played This Edition?</span></p><p>No, though I do use a lot of 1E monsters in my 2E games. Also, full disclosure: I’ve never run or played in any game with a beholder, ever.</p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px">Technical Presentation</span></p><p>The stat block begins with encounter building information, which makes a lot of sense in a game where monsters appear in random encounters. Then it sort of gets hard to follow. We’ve got what looks like combat information (movement speed and hit dice), then more encounter building information (% in lair, treasure type), then more combat information (attacks, damage, specials). Then finally we have role playing and exploration information intelligence, alignment, size) followed by yet more combat information (psionic ability). </p><p></p><p>Why are the combat stats mixed in with all the other stuff? I suppose it’s important to keep in mind that 1E rewards players who avoid combat—so from that point of view movement speed and (maybe?) HD are useful to put ahead of the combat section, because players will probably attempt to outrun or hide from the threat. And maybe 1E psionics are not really combat?—I don’t really know, as I will freely admit that I’ve never been able to make sense of that part of the game.</p><p></p><p><em>Maybe the 1E stat block format works really well for 1E. But, I've learned that when running 1E/OSR monsters in other games, the DM' is well-served by a set of colored highlighters and a willingness to mark up an expensive book.</em></p><p></p><p>Moving down to the descriptive prose, we start with a physical description, with advice about habitat. Then (in the same paragraph) we get detailed info about the AC of eye stalks and the central eye. It’s heavily implied that the smart way to fight a beholder is to dismantle it eye by eye, rather than to attack the body and waste time wearing down its ablative hp.</p><p></p><p>Next we have two separate sections, one devoted to the eye attacks (which further reinforces the notion that eye stalks ought to be targeted first), and one detailing the Beholder’s behavior if the PCs try to negotiate.</p><p></p><p><em>All in all, I find the prose layout reasonably clear, other than the (very questionable) decision to squeeze eye stalk AC info in the same paragraph as their preferred habitat.</em></p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px">What Kind of Ideas Does This Give Me?</span></p><p>Geeze, what a nasty thing to throw at 1E players! No matter which way the encounter goes, it’s sure to be memorable. Do they sweat their way through a negotiation? Do they run with their tails between their legs? Do they cooperate to dismantle the creature’s eye stalks before it devastates them? I almost want to put a 1E beholder in my game now, so I can see how my group handles it.</p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px">Playstyle Quote</span></p><p></p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px">Final Rating</span></p><p><span style="font-size: 12px"></span>I award this MM entry eight severed eye stalks out of ten.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="dd.stevenson, post: 6272702, member: 6683099"] [SIZE=4][URL="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/files/excerpts/excerpt_mm2.pdf"]D&D 1st Edition Beholder[/URL][/SIZE] [SIZE=3]Have I Played This Edition?[/SIZE] No, though I do use a lot of 1E monsters in my 2E games. Also, full disclosure: I’ve never run or played in any game with a beholder, ever. [SIZE=3]Technical Presentation[/SIZE] The stat block begins with encounter building information, which makes a lot of sense in a game where monsters appear in random encounters. Then it sort of gets hard to follow. We’ve got what looks like combat information (movement speed and hit dice), then more encounter building information (% in lair, treasure type), then more combat information (attacks, damage, specials). Then finally we have role playing and exploration information intelligence, alignment, size) followed by yet more combat information (psionic ability). Why are the combat stats mixed in with all the other stuff? I suppose it’s important to keep in mind that 1E rewards players who avoid combat—so from that point of view movement speed and (maybe?) HD are useful to put ahead of the combat section, because players will probably attempt to outrun or hide from the threat. And maybe 1E psionics are not really combat?—I don’t really know, as I will freely admit that I’ve never been able to make sense of that part of the game. [I]Maybe the 1E stat block format works really well for 1E. But, I've learned that when running 1E/OSR monsters in other games, the DM' is well-served by a set of colored highlighters and a willingness to mark up an expensive book.[/I] Moving down to the descriptive prose, we start with a physical description, with advice about habitat. Then (in the same paragraph) we get detailed info about the AC of eye stalks and the central eye. It’s heavily implied that the smart way to fight a beholder is to dismantle it eye by eye, rather than to attack the body and waste time wearing down its ablative hp. Next we have two separate sections, one devoted to the eye attacks (which further reinforces the notion that eye stalks ought to be targeted first), and one detailing the Beholder’s behavior if the PCs try to negotiate. [I]All in all, I find the prose layout reasonably clear, other than the (very questionable) decision to squeeze eye stalk AC info in the same paragraph as their preferred habitat.[/I] [SIZE=3]What Kind of Ideas Does This Give Me?[/SIZE] Geeze, what a nasty thing to throw at 1E players! No matter which way the encounter goes, it’s sure to be memorable. Do they sweat their way through a negotiation? Do they run with their tails between their legs? Do they cooperate to dismantle the creature’s eye stalks before it devastates them? I almost want to put a 1E beholder in my game now, so I can see how my group handles it. [SIZE=3]Playstyle Quote[/SIZE] [SIZE=3]Final Rating [/SIZE]I award this MM entry eight severed eye stalks out of ten. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Let’s Compare: Many Different Monster Manuals
Top