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Let's Talk About RPG Worldbuilding
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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8331363" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>Of course there's no disputing taste, but there are also some factual claims in your post that are not true (as [USER=16814]@Ovinomancer[/USER] has already mentioned).</p><p></p><p>I don't play games that are <em>nothing but player wish fulfilment</em>, but that has very little connection to how setting is established/the gameworld is built. See, for instance, the sorts of mechanics I describe in my post just upthread - Circles and Wises in Burning Wheel. I have fairly extensive experience with these both as a player and a GM. They do not leave <em>how the world is built up to the GM</em>. But nor are they <em>nothing but player wish-fulfilment</em>. They are mechanics that involve checks and success or failure just like anything else in the game.</p><p></p><p>There is a recurrent premise in discussions of worldbuilding, which seems to me to be present in you final three sentences. I think the premise is obviously false. It is this: that because <em>in the real world</em> there is a difference between (stable, enduring) things and (transient, ever-changing) events, so when fiction is authored in a RPG we must distinguish between who gets to decide on the things and who gets to decide on the events.</p><p></p><p>But in fact, there is no difference, as far as RPG authoring is concerned, between <em>the Elves long ago built these towers</em>, <em>I find a secret door in the base of the towers</em>, <em>I meet the guardian of the towers</em>, <em>I attack the guardian of the towers</em> or <em>I kill the guardian of the towers</em>. Each is a candidate proposition to be accepted as part of the shared fiction. Each can be made the subject of authorial fiat - eg in the DL modules it is the module author who decides, in advance, the truth of propositions about who built what where, and who might be killed by whom (via the "obscure death" rule). There is also strong encouragement for the GM to decide by fiat what things are found and what things are met. (It is left to the players, to some extent, to decide what things are attacked.)</p><p></p><p>But just as each can be made the subject of authorial fiat, so each can be made the subject of a check - eg an Elves-wise or Towers-wise check (to establish who built the towers, and when); a Perception or Secret Door-wise check (to make it true that <em>I find a secret door in the base of the towers</em>); some sort of encounter check, perhaps, to determine who if anyone is met when the towers are entered; some sort of personality or rage check, perhaps, to determine who attacks whom; and combat mechanics of the sort found in many RPGs to determine who kills whom in a fight.</p><p></p><p>Different RPGs, and different approaches adopted by players of those different RPGs, use different methods for settling the "truth", in the fiction, of these various propositions. I'm not aware of any particular correlation between those various mixes of methods and whether play is boring or not. Nor of any correlation with believability.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8331363, member: 42582"] Of course there's no disputing taste, but there are also some factual claims in your post that are not true (as [USER=16814]@Ovinomancer[/USER] has already mentioned). I don't play games that are [I]nothing but player wish fulfilment[/I], but that has very little connection to how setting is established/the gameworld is built. See, for instance, the sorts of mechanics I describe in my post just upthread - Circles and Wises in Burning Wheel. I have fairly extensive experience with these both as a player and a GM. They do not leave [I]how the world is built up to the GM[/I]. But nor are they [I]nothing but player wish-fulfilment[/I]. They are mechanics that involve checks and success or failure just like anything else in the game. There is a recurrent premise in discussions of worldbuilding, which seems to me to be present in you final three sentences. I think the premise is obviously false. It is this: that because [I]in the real world[/I] there is a difference between (stable, enduring) things and (transient, ever-changing) events, so when fiction is authored in a RPG we must distinguish between who gets to decide on the things and who gets to decide on the events. But in fact, there is no difference, as far as RPG authoring is concerned, between [I]the Elves long ago built these towers[/I], [I]I find a secret door in the base of the towers[/I], [I]I meet the guardian of the towers[/I], [I]I attack the guardian of the towers[/I] or [I]I kill the guardian of the towers[/I]. Each is a candidate proposition to be accepted as part of the shared fiction. Each can be made the subject of authorial fiat - eg in the DL modules it is the module author who decides, in advance, the truth of propositions about who built what where, and who might be killed by whom (via the "obscure death" rule). There is also strong encouragement for the GM to decide by fiat what things are found and what things are met. (It is left to the players, to some extent, to decide what things are attacked.) But just as each can be made the subject of authorial fiat, so each can be made the subject of a check - eg an Elves-wise or Towers-wise check (to establish who built the towers, and when); a Perception or Secret Door-wise check (to make it true that [I]I find a secret door in the base of the towers[/I]); some sort of encounter check, perhaps, to determine who if anyone is met when the towers are entered; some sort of personality or rage check, perhaps, to determine who attacks whom; and combat mechanics of the sort found in many RPGs to determine who kills whom in a fight. Different RPGs, and different approaches adopted by players of those different RPGs, use different methods for settling the "truth", in the fiction, of these various propositions. I'm not aware of any particular correlation between those various mixes of methods and whether play is boring or not. Nor of any correlation with believability. [/QUOTE]
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