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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Guest 6801328" data-source="post: 6866324">As I wrote in my reply to Yunru I can see that, but it's already a finesse weapon so I'm not suggesting a change there, and I'm not suggesting that Rogues get whip proficiency by default, and whether they wield it in their main-hand or off-hand doesn't actually change the utility of that trick.  (Well, actually, it would be slightly less useful in their off-hand because they lose the damage bonus.)Sure, me too.  That's why I'm focusing on whips.Yeah, and as I posted above Whip Master and Dual-Wielding could both be useful at the same time.  If Whip Master let you treat the Whip as light it would only let you dual wield it with another light weapon, so Dual-Wielding would let you use a full-damage weapon in your main hand, and give you the +1 AC. (And of course you could always use two full-sized weapons whenever you wanted as well.)  Full benefit, all the time? No. But the same could be said of any two Feats that give you a reaction, for example.  E.g. Mage Slayer and Sentinel and Duelist.  I probably would, unless I'm missing a use that would make it OP...which is entirely possible.  (Rules lawyers might require language stating that you can't make your additional unarmed strikes unless you're within 5'.)Anyway, to all of the above, when I look at the weapons chart (excluding whip), I see that:Simple melee weapons have a base damage of 1d6, Martial melee weapons have a base damage of 1d8Finesse doesn't seem to have any "budget value" except that it is mutually exclusive with versatile, and has damage capped at base damage.  (E.g. Short Sword vs. Quarterstaff, or Rapier vs. Longsword)Reach "costs" a reduction in damage by one step.  (E.g. Halberd vs. Greataxe)Light also costs a reduction in damage by one step.  (E.g. Scimitar vs. Rapier)So by those rules, a whip should be 1d6.  It's not.  Adding 'light' would restore budget balance.  (Although I'd be ok with adding a special note that they can't be dual-wielded despite being light.)  So a character who wanted to dual-wield would have to make the choice between doing 1d6 every round with their offhand versus doing 1d4 every round and occasionally getting that offhand attack at 10'.Thoughts?</blockquote>

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