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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GenghisDon" data-source="post: 6901169" data-attributes="member: 29824">I see this sort of complaint often, but never understand it fully. OK, in ALL the AD&D & classic D&D games, pretty much every class/level progression is a doubling of XP per level, up until "name level", THEN it becomes a static (large) number thereafter. For most classes, the difference between 10 & 11 or 17 & 18 are the same. Thus, VHL play is NOT slower, it picks up in pace, actually (face greater challenges, requirements the same). However, it IS fairly slow in general at the "top" levels. The "top levels" are more or less 10+. Now, you seem to have used most, or all, of the optional 2e XP methods, and having played that game a great deal, I simply cannot understand how advancement would be slow that way. It should be fast enough for anyone. If somehow it is not, you could double amounts perhaps. I think you ought try what you say u did before though. L15 characters probably HAVE died a few times. 24+ adventures for L15? probably/possibly. When I play 2e I use the options, individual class options, and NOT GP=XP (classic & 1e are GP & monster only, I use that there). Seems fast enough for me/my players. A major factor, for any of those older games, is that we play a pretty rapid paced, conflict heavy game. They lend themselves to such. Way less options for combat, forget moving figurines about, smaller numbers to work with, it all leads to much more getting done.  I cannot speak to 5e at all, but for, say, 3.5e, yes it advanced quickly too, as each encounter gave a much bigger % of the way to the next level, but we'd only get a tiny fraction as many encounters done in the same time period. It was different, and just as good, in a different way. Actually, it advanced a bit too fast, as players never got anywhere near as good at playing their character as they do in slower advancing games, because one is always adding new abilities/changing considerably. Players are terrible at knowing what will make a good, satisfying game; rules & ideas on that they might have are almost always wrong headed. People think they want X/getting X will make them happy, but it's not that simple. Most modern players would be better served being slowed down some regarding level advancement. They are always hungry for more levels, XP, etc, but that doesn't mean you try to fill the glutton's gut as fast as u can.EDIT: and yes, xp per hp is definitely a 1e thing. Not that it's all THAT different overall, but 1e had fine advancement rates too IMHO. On the retiring at L10 or so...yes, that's what Gary & company did back in the early days (mostly). We NEVER did that, EVER. I never had a player that scratched & clawed their way to power & then didn't want to flex/use it. Frankly, anyone playing AD&D would never guess to stop at L10 (or so); yeah, OD&D & early classic D&D games pretty much had nothing for higher level play, but AD&D sure as heck did. My players wanted to try those L6, 7, 8 & maybe even L9 spells! They wanted to face demon lords, liches & so forth.</blockquote>

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