Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Levels 1-4 are "Training Wheels?"
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8515079" data-attributes="member: 6987520"><p>Really? I have always found the subclass to be superfluous and wouldn't even miss them if they were gone from the game.</p><p></p><p>To my mind, the functions would revolve around:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Barbarian - Level 1 rage, their primary function.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Bard - Level 1 inspiration, their "thing", or spellcasting, also a huge part of their function.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Cleric - gets subclass at level 1 anyway..., but otherwise spellcasting--subclass is a 50/50 thing IMO.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Druid - no even sure what their function is? wildshaping? spellcasting? <img class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" alt="🤷♂️" title="Man shrugging :man_shrugging:" src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f937-2642.png" data-shortname=":man_shrugging:" /> so levels 1 or 2?</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Fighter - Level 1 fighting style or level 2 action surge? They can fight from Level 1 and that is their function...</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Monk - Level 1 martial arts, or probably level 2, Ki, their thing for functioning.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Paladin - Level 2 smites, their primary function IME, but even level 1 lay on hands is pretty iconic.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ranger - RAW a lost cause so not touching this one...</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Rogue - Level 1 expertise <em>and</em> sneak attack-- enough said. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sorcerer - subclass has nothing to do with their functioning really, it is font of magic and metamagic at levels 2 and 3 really.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Warlock - subclass at level 1 has little to do with their "function", which is really all about eldritch invocations IME at level 2.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wizard - spellcasting at level 1 and arcane recovery, so functioning out of the gate.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Level 1's are Barbarian, Bards, Clerics (subclass sometimes, sometimes not a big part of function), Fighter, Rogue, Wizard. That's half the classes at level 1 and really only the cleric has any function-based thing from subclass.</p><p></p><p>Level 2's are Druids (subclass <em>meh</em> except for Moon), Monk, Paladin, Warlock. That's another 4.</p><p></p><p>Level 3's are really just Sorcerers when Metamagic (nothing to do with subclass) comes online.</p><p></p><p>Ranger's are probably the <em>ONLY</em> class whose subclass comes at 3rd level that really need it to help define how they should actually function. But that is really more because Favored Enemy is about as lame as you can get.</p><p></p><p>So, with the vast majority of classes actually functioning as intended before level 3 and not even relying on subclasses, I don't see how its a "fact" really.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="DND_Reborn, post: 8515079, member: 6987520"] Really? I have always found the subclass to be superfluous and wouldn't even miss them if they were gone from the game. To my mind, the functions would revolve around: [LIST] [*]Barbarian - Level 1 rage, their primary function. [*]Bard - Level 1 inspiration, their "thing", or spellcasting, also a huge part of their function. [*]Cleric - gets subclass at level 1 anyway..., but otherwise spellcasting--subclass is a 50/50 thing IMO. [*]Druid - no even sure what their function is? wildshaping? spellcasting? 🤷♂️ so levels 1 or 2? [*]Fighter - Level 1 fighting style or level 2 action surge? They can fight from Level 1 and that is their function... [*]Monk - Level 1 martial arts, or probably level 2, Ki, their thing for functioning. [*]Paladin - Level 2 smites, their primary function IME, but even level 1 lay on hands is pretty iconic. [*]Ranger - RAW a lost cause so not touching this one... [*]Rogue - Level 1 expertise [I]and[/I] sneak attack-- enough said. :) [*]Sorcerer - subclass has nothing to do with their functioning really, it is font of magic and metamagic at levels 2 and 3 really. [*]Warlock - subclass at level 1 has little to do with their "function", which is really all about eldritch invocations IME at level 2. [*]Wizard - spellcasting at level 1 and arcane recovery, so functioning out of the gate. [/LIST] Level 1's are Barbarian, Bards, Clerics (subclass sometimes, sometimes not a big part of function), Fighter, Rogue, Wizard. That's half the classes at level 1 and really only the cleric has any function-based thing from subclass. Level 2's are Druids (subclass [I]meh[/I] except for Moon), Monk, Paladin, Warlock. That's another 4. Level 3's are really just Sorcerers when Metamagic (nothing to do with subclass) comes online. Ranger's are probably the [I]ONLY[/I] class whose subclass comes at 3rd level that really need it to help define how they should actually function. But that is really more because Favored Enemy is about as lame as you can get. So, with the vast majority of classes actually functioning as intended before level 3 and not even relying on subclasses, I don't see how its a "fact" really. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Levels 1-4 are "Training Wheels?"
Top