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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Kemrain" data-source="post: 972365" data-attributes="member: 12153">However, I have imposed societal restrictions on my PrC's, so that only the people who devote themselves to them and their respective groups can start and progress. This means that most of them won’t work at all in other games, but that’s OK to me, because they were never meant to.The Keepers are a scholarly and mystical organization, I agree.  For those career paths, I have decided to make more 5 level PrC’s that will stack on top of the original Keeper class.  A Keeper Mystic or Keeper Scholar make wonderful ideas, and I think I will even give the Mystical students limited spell access, mostly to the divination school.  Think of a spell progression similar to the Assassin PrC in the DMG.  I think something like that could work and be appropriate for the feel of the game, and still let me keep a tight control over the availability and commonality of Magics.  I am doing my best to keep magic something terribly mysterious, and killing the core magic classes and giving people new spell lists is one, rather exhaustive, way of achieving that goal.Do you have any ideas as to what abilities a Keeper Mystic or Keeper Scholar might possess? Do you have any idea what the 3rd (I wanted to make 3 for balance) Keeper PrC should be? My D&D training says make it combat oriented, but that’s crazy, and I’m a little lost as to how I could make a Keeper even more stealthy and skill-oriented.The 15+ Intelligence Requirement.  Okay, you’re right. I was just looking for a way to have another prerequisite, and you’re right in saying that that’s not the way the designers of the Prestige class concept thought it should go.  It’s out, and I realize the class is strengthened by it.  However, I now feel that I should require something more to take this class.  Uncanny Dodge makes sense to me, and it isn’t harsh in restricting the classes you can enter the PrC from, because the only classes available at 1st level are Rogue, Commoner, Expert and (Maybe) Aristocrat.  That in of it’s self is harsh, but it fits the type of game I want this to be, and my players were OK with it.Your point about Urban Lore is a good one, but after thinking about it, I’ve decided to let it stay.  It might lower the value of a skill point, but I’ve also increased the number of skill points everyone gets.  I also want there to be a separation between Urban survival and Wilderness survival, because the PC’s may have to spend time out side the city walls, for instance, on their way to Cragscleft, or hunting down that Pagan village.  I want to make sure that they have a rough time of it, and making wilderness survival separate and cross classed is a good way to keep them from feeling comfortable outside the walls.  I want them to fear the wilds, as all good little Manfools should.Oh, I almost forgot.  The Spiritual Hammer reference.  From watching the way the spell is cast and used, I have decided how I’ll use that in my game.  Take the Inflict Wounds spells, change them into Ranged Touch Attacks, and, maybe, give them no verbal component. In the games, I watched Hammers throw these without speaking, though I think it would add more flavor to have them chant a prayer to the builder.  Spiritual Hammer makes a weapon that attacks on it’s own, and lasts for multiple rounds.  To me, that isn’t what the spell did in the games.  A Ranged Touch Attack, IMO, fits what we see best.Thank you again for posting a reply.  I am thrilled to have you look at my ideas. Thanks a ton.- Kemrain the Grateful</blockquote>

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