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<blockquote data-quote="AtomicPope" data-source="post: 8517459" data-attributes="member: 64790">As a long time DM in 5e, I have no problem with cantrips.&nbsp; They're not game breaking.&nbsp; Nor to they outperform other classes.&nbsp; In many ways they don't hold up to weapon attacks.&nbsp; A basic weapon attack with a chosen stat adds the stat's damage, while a basic cantrip doesn't.&nbsp; When a cantrip has an effect the damage dice is lower.&nbsp; The damage increases as part of a constraint (Toll of the Dead, Booming Blade).&nbsp; Adding a damage die for levels still falls behind multi-attack because they lack stat modifiers, and even further behind multi-attack with feats, class features, and magic weapons.&nbsp; I don't want to go back to the days of throwing darts and shooting crossbows.Cantrips are best when they have a control option like Ray of Frost or Thornwhip, or they also add utility like Produce Flame.&nbsp; Cantrips that focus on damage (Eldritch Blast and Firebolt) are less useful overall because their only use is damage and they're just not that good.&nbsp; EB can be boosted with Invocations, and that helps, but now we're getting into a game design issue.&nbsp; When a class leans so heavily on a cantrip we should be looking at turning that cantrip into a class feature rather than glorifying a zero level spell.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AtomicPope, post: 8517459, member: 64790"] As a long time DM in 5e, I have no problem with cantrips. They're not game breaking. Nor to they outperform other classes. In many ways they don't hold up to weapon attacks. A basic weapon attack with a chosen stat adds the stat's damage, while a basic cantrip doesn't. When a cantrip has an effect the damage dice is lower. The damage increases as part of a constraint (Toll of the Dead, Booming Blade). Adding a damage die for levels still falls behind multi-attack because they lack stat modifiers, and even further behind multi-attack with feats, class features, and magic weapons. I don't want to go back to the days of throwing darts and shooting crossbows. Cantrips are best when they have a control option like Ray of Frost or Thornwhip, or they also add utility like Produce Flame. Cantrips that focus on damage (Eldritch Blast and Firebolt) are less useful overall because their only use is damage and they're just not that good. EB can be boosted with Invocations, and that helps, but now we're getting into a game design issue. When a class leans so heavily on a cantrip we should be looking at turning that cantrip into a class feature rather than glorifying a zero level spell. [/QUOTE]

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