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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 7240160" data-attributes="member: 82106">First I'd point out that NOTHING in Tolkien hints at arcane wizardry, Gandalf is a Maiar, a spirit-being constructed whole cloth by Ea itself, infused with a kind of life by the 'Secret Flame' and sent down into Varda to carry out Ea's will. While knowledge is certainly useful to Gandalf it isn't the SOURCE of his power by any means. While Rowling's wizards certainly partake of much book learning and lore, they also have inherent magical prowess, without which one is nothing but a 'muggle'. Nor do they even control the types of magic which they can wield, this appears to be a matter of character and inheritance. At best book learning in this particular world seems to hone one's powers, focus them, and provide one with lore which can direct a character's overall efforts in different directions.I wouldn't say the traditions of Crowley and Theosophy are those of 'a few centuries ago', they are thoroughly constructs of the late 19th and early 20th Centuries. Certainly Crowley, etc. drew on material of earlier times and built their systems out of bits and pieces of medieval alchemy, Kabalism, etc. but it is thoroughly their own. Admittedly, post-medieval magical traditions have been infused with a degree of scientific sensibility, so maybe there's some truth to the idea that this made an impression on Vance and others.Certainly its hard to say that Vance didn't espouse an idea of book learning. However I would note that his tone is very disparaging of that very learning, his wizards seem to primarily rely on ancient artifacts and higher beings for their real power, and they actually have virtually NO understanding of the magic they wield, simply regurgitating ancient spell formulae which they have memorized. It is virtually unknown for a Dying Earth wizard to actually create an original work of magic. They are less book learned than facile at picking through ancient debris and making use of what they find.Sure, but that isn't really a workable approach, certainly not in a 4e-based game. I DO think rituals are underrated in general, and I made a wizard once who actually exploited them heavily to some pretty interesting effect, but what would you do in combat? I think you'd at least have to allow for some sort of system of enchanting objects with temporary effects. This might actually work reasonably well though. At each short rest the wizard picks from the effects he's learned about and instantiates a couple of them as usable powers. Instead of A/E/D you'd have maybe some sort of slotted setup, so you could pick a couple of E's, or one D, and you could pretty much always get an A, though if you eschewed it you might pick say a D and an E instead. Utility powers in this kind of system wouldn't need to really exist, you could perhaps just always have a couple of 'instantiated' utilities of whatever sort you want, with the number increasing by levels or something.Anyway, its a thought...</blockquote>

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