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Lore Questions About Spelljamming Uses of Magic, Cosmology, Metaphysics
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<blockquote data-quote="Aelryinth" data-source="post: 7902102" data-attributes="member: 10515"><p>Greyhawk has general magic, it's overdeity of magic is Boccob. You are thinking of the Dragonlance world of Krynn. FR has a mostly singular pantheon, unlike Greyhawk, which has 3 active competing ones (more like Earth)</p><p></p><p></p><p>That is correct, but they must have SUFFICIENT numbers to do so, if they are an existing god. This is considered expanding their inflence, and is generally regarded the same way you'd see a hobo setting up a tent on your front lawn.</p><p>False gods based on worship do exist in the setting.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Only in the Forgotten Realms, although using the term elsewhere doesn't hurt. The Weave, however, implies a Weaver, who is Mystra. In other worlds, magic might not need her control. The main reason behind the Weave is that both mortals and gods abuse the hell out of magic, and without the Weave there, it would all explode or collapse under their power-hungry fingers.</p><p></p><p>-----</p><p></p><p></p><p>Spelljammer is a way to travel from campaign world to world without leaving the Prime Material Plane. Leave the crystal sphere of your homeworld, go out into the phlogiston, sail to the new crystal sphere.</p><p>You can also do so by traveling through the Ethereal Plane, going into the deep ethereal and risking getting lost and nasty encounters; by finding the appropriate color pool in the Astral Plane (also daring encounters of soul-hunting outsiders and githyanki); or by plane-shifting to another plane, and then plane-shifting to the new world on the prime, if allowed to do so.</p><p>Technically speaking, a Wish or Interplanetary Teleport could get you to a new world, too.</p><p>Technically all game worlds are on the Prime Material Plane, but may be alternate dimensions within it, especially with house rules.</p><p>Earth exists and has been visited by both FR and Greyhawk natives in the past. There is a famous Dragon Magazine module where you go collect the Mace of St. Cuthbert, a divine artifact, from a museum on Earth. There's even elven jewelry on display there.</p><p>There are sci-fi settings with no magic at all, that have been visited by magic-users, and magic works there. Metamorphosis Alpha and the Starship Warden are classic tropes of this. So is Boot Hill, and characters often adventured from one to the other.</p><p>Where magic doesn't work at all? That is largely a DM call. There's no rule saying that characters with magic powers lose them in Star Frontiers or Star Trek. If you rule it so, then that's that. Can they DEVELOP them there? Without the classes, no.</p><p>Most planes are considered infinite, yet with borders, which is metaphysics at work. Paizo's Pathfinder world is set up like the real universe, without crystal spheres, for example. So, most planes you go on are infinite, but if you know how to, you can find the metaphysical border fairly easily.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Because the other gods would turn it back on to further theirs. Generally, removing magic destroys worship of the divine, because they can't answer prayers. Gods can get ornery if you try to do that to them. Balance!</p><p></p><p></p><p>It's a maintenance system for the magic of the realms.</p><p>FR is FULL of high level magic users. Seriously. Pretty much every major city has an archmage. Gods walked the lands, ancient dragons were everywhere, the elves had veritiable legions of archcasters, Netheril had post-30 casters, etc. They put massive amounts of pressure on magic, and the Weave was designed to keep the whole thing in place and working, without exploding and Bad Things Happening (like creating the Sea of Fallen Stars, and the Netheril Desert. Oops!)</p><p>Just think of it as another word for 'magic maintenance program', and Mystra sitting up there as the system overseer, and you're fine. Mechanically, it defines the limits on magic and how spells work, which is why magic is different between editions as the Weave gets a new operating system.</p><p></p><p></p><p>YES!</p><p>This was actually one of the things addressed in Spelljammer. You actually could buy altars that would allow you to connect to your deity in foreign spheres.</p><p>It also encouraged you to be a pantheist, or a planarist. If you were a pantheist, any plane that worshipped a god in your pantheon, you had spells. So, someone worshipping the Norse, Finnish, and Greek Pantheons could get spells in Realmspace via Tyr, Mieklikki, and Sune (Venus) respectively (and the Egyptian, Chinese, Japanese, Indian, and Babylonian Pantheons are there, too). A planarist of the Seven Heavens could get their spells as long as any LG god living in the Seven Heavens was worshipped there.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Via Divine power. No, gods don't 'need' the Weave, but they are restricted by it in FR... although Mystra has to be careful not to piss them off by controlling it.</p><p>The Weave was created by Mystra when she came into being. It's basically her divine domain.</p><p>Magic existed before the gods, and will exist after them. There's no defined origin to it yet overall, no 'Big Bang' that brought it in. That's not to say you can't introduce one to your campaign!</p><p></p><p></p><p>They don't use it, but they are restricted by it. The energies are similar enough that limitations on the Weave tend to carry over to psionics... so high-level psions don't throw around divine-level magic any easier then spellcasters do.</p><p>Psionics may or may not work in some places, just like magic. It's a DM call. There are no official settings that say 'no psionics'.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Rules short hand. It basically means 'this is a born magical being, not a plebe mortal like you, who had to LEARN to use magic.'</p><p></p><p></p><p>Without a divine spark, you've got no god. False gods basically steal worship and give it back. They don't have domains, have no divine spark, and are finite beings. They don't represent cosmic forces... they just pour faith in one side and out the other.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Most gods exist in the outer planes, past the Astral Plane. Their homes are usually the final destinations of souls. Some cosmologies may have them living elsewhere, like the inner planes, or their own planes.</p><p>Their homes are tied to where they have worshipers. You may or may not be able to go from their homes to another Prime Material World, depending on the cosmology. If you use the Great Wheel, souls from all over the multiverse converge on those planes, so you can go to any Prime world from those planes, because all the gods of all the alignments dwell on the Great Wheel.</p><p>But in a homebrew, a god might only be served on one world, and only have connections there, with none to the greater multiverse.</p><p>In the baseline cosmology, connections are to the greater multiverse. If you go to the Seven Heavens from FR, you will enter it through a realm belonging to one of the LG gods who live there (Tyr, Torm, Ilmater, etc). You can then walk to the edge of their domain into that of their buddy Heironeous over there, and head on down to Oerth from there fairly easily... or wander around forever, never leaving the Triad's domain.</p><p></p><p>Demiplanes are simply pocket dimensions, usually made by powerful spellcasters in the past. There are actually spells out there that allow spellcasters to create demiplanes, and if they are old enough, they can get quite large.</p><p>Demiplanes created by deities are very small places for such entities, and so tend to be used only by demigods and such weaker beings, or as prison planes or storage places. It is far more likely they were created by mighty spellcasters or mighty non-gods for specific purposes and homes of their own. If those beings die, the demiplanes tend to degrade over time. They make great adventuring places, because they aren't that much different from instance dungeons in a video game. Whatever you want to be inside, can be inside one!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Aelryinth, post: 7902102, member: 10515"] Greyhawk has general magic, it's overdeity of magic is Boccob. You are thinking of the Dragonlance world of Krynn. FR has a mostly singular pantheon, unlike Greyhawk, which has 3 active competing ones (more like Earth) That is correct, but they must have SUFFICIENT numbers to do so, if they are an existing god. This is considered expanding their inflence, and is generally regarded the same way you'd see a hobo setting up a tent on your front lawn. False gods based on worship do exist in the setting. Only in the Forgotten Realms, although using the term elsewhere doesn't hurt. The Weave, however, implies a Weaver, who is Mystra. In other worlds, magic might not need her control. The main reason behind the Weave is that both mortals and gods abuse the hell out of magic, and without the Weave there, it would all explode or collapse under their power-hungry fingers. ----- Spelljammer is a way to travel from campaign world to world without leaving the Prime Material Plane. Leave the crystal sphere of your homeworld, go out into the phlogiston, sail to the new crystal sphere. You can also do so by traveling through the Ethereal Plane, going into the deep ethereal and risking getting lost and nasty encounters; by finding the appropriate color pool in the Astral Plane (also daring encounters of soul-hunting outsiders and githyanki); or by plane-shifting to another plane, and then plane-shifting to the new world on the prime, if allowed to do so. Technically speaking, a Wish or Interplanetary Teleport could get you to a new world, too. Technically all game worlds are on the Prime Material Plane, but may be alternate dimensions within it, especially with house rules. Earth exists and has been visited by both FR and Greyhawk natives in the past. There is a famous Dragon Magazine module where you go collect the Mace of St. Cuthbert, a divine artifact, from a museum on Earth. There's even elven jewelry on display there. There are sci-fi settings with no magic at all, that have been visited by magic-users, and magic works there. Metamorphosis Alpha and the Starship Warden are classic tropes of this. So is Boot Hill, and characters often adventured from one to the other. Where magic doesn't work at all? That is largely a DM call. There's no rule saying that characters with magic powers lose them in Star Frontiers or Star Trek. If you rule it so, then that's that. Can they DEVELOP them there? Without the classes, no. Most planes are considered infinite, yet with borders, which is metaphysics at work. Paizo's Pathfinder world is set up like the real universe, without crystal spheres, for example. So, most planes you go on are infinite, but if you know how to, you can find the metaphysical border fairly easily. Because the other gods would turn it back on to further theirs. Generally, removing magic destroys worship of the divine, because they can't answer prayers. Gods can get ornery if you try to do that to them. Balance! It's a maintenance system for the magic of the realms. FR is FULL of high level magic users. Seriously. Pretty much every major city has an archmage. Gods walked the lands, ancient dragons were everywhere, the elves had veritiable legions of archcasters, Netheril had post-30 casters, etc. They put massive amounts of pressure on magic, and the Weave was designed to keep the whole thing in place and working, without exploding and Bad Things Happening (like creating the Sea of Fallen Stars, and the Netheril Desert. Oops!) Just think of it as another word for 'magic maintenance program', and Mystra sitting up there as the system overseer, and you're fine. Mechanically, it defines the limits on magic and how spells work, which is why magic is different between editions as the Weave gets a new operating system. YES! This was actually one of the things addressed in Spelljammer. You actually could buy altars that would allow you to connect to your deity in foreign spheres. It also encouraged you to be a pantheist, or a planarist. If you were a pantheist, any plane that worshipped a god in your pantheon, you had spells. So, someone worshipping the Norse, Finnish, and Greek Pantheons could get spells in Realmspace via Tyr, Mieklikki, and Sune (Venus) respectively (and the Egyptian, Chinese, Japanese, Indian, and Babylonian Pantheons are there, too). A planarist of the Seven Heavens could get their spells as long as any LG god living in the Seven Heavens was worshipped there. Via Divine power. No, gods don't 'need' the Weave, but they are restricted by it in FR... although Mystra has to be careful not to piss them off by controlling it. The Weave was created by Mystra when she came into being. It's basically her divine domain. Magic existed before the gods, and will exist after them. There's no defined origin to it yet overall, no 'Big Bang' that brought it in. That's not to say you can't introduce one to your campaign! They don't use it, but they are restricted by it. The energies are similar enough that limitations on the Weave tend to carry over to psionics... so high-level psions don't throw around divine-level magic any easier then spellcasters do. Psionics may or may not work in some places, just like magic. It's a DM call. There are no official settings that say 'no psionics'. Rules short hand. It basically means 'this is a born magical being, not a plebe mortal like you, who had to LEARN to use magic.' Without a divine spark, you've got no god. False gods basically steal worship and give it back. They don't have domains, have no divine spark, and are finite beings. They don't represent cosmic forces... they just pour faith in one side and out the other. Most gods exist in the outer planes, past the Astral Plane. Their homes are usually the final destinations of souls. Some cosmologies may have them living elsewhere, like the inner planes, or their own planes. Their homes are tied to where they have worshipers. You may or may not be able to go from their homes to another Prime Material World, depending on the cosmology. If you use the Great Wheel, souls from all over the multiverse converge on those planes, so you can go to any Prime world from those planes, because all the gods of all the alignments dwell on the Great Wheel. But in a homebrew, a god might only be served on one world, and only have connections there, with none to the greater multiverse. In the baseline cosmology, connections are to the greater multiverse. If you go to the Seven Heavens from FR, you will enter it through a realm belonging to one of the LG gods who live there (Tyr, Torm, Ilmater, etc). You can then walk to the edge of their domain into that of their buddy Heironeous over there, and head on down to Oerth from there fairly easily... or wander around forever, never leaving the Triad's domain. Demiplanes are simply pocket dimensions, usually made by powerful spellcasters in the past. There are actually spells out there that allow spellcasters to create demiplanes, and if they are old enough, they can get quite large. Demiplanes created by deities are very small places for such entities, and so tend to be used only by demigods and such weaker beings, or as prison planes or storage places. It is far more likely they were created by mighty spellcasters or mighty non-gods for specific purposes and homes of their own. If those beings die, the demiplanes tend to degrade over time. They make great adventuring places, because they aren't that much different from instance dungeons in a video game. Whatever you want to be inside, can be inside one! [/QUOTE]
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