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"loseing is not cost effective"
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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 4710734" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>Yeah, for their level kobolds are one of the more troublesome monsters. Shifty really does cause people a lot of trouble! lol.</p><p></p><p>4e is a LOT more tactical than earlier editions. In some ways that's good, but it can be troublesome for a group of players that are used to sort of just 'pressing the buttons' on their characters in combat. It also relies a LOT more on combining the actions of different characters together to make you effective. It may be that your party hasn't yet figured out the best way to do that, and/or some of the players just aren't of that mindset. Personally I think they may have overdone it a bit, it can be pretty hard to play 4e if you just aren't interested in or particularly talented at tactics.</p><p></p><p>As for the problem of going on without dailies. It CAN be a problem. You could run into 2-3 ordinary difficulty encounters and have no problems. You could even beat some harder encounters with good tactics and maybe a bit of luck without expending dailies. The real problem comes when you get into that crunch encounter where around 4-5 rounds in you start to realize you're in over your head. Normally you'd burn your dailies, an AP, an encounter power, and either cut the enemy down to size quick or create a situation where you can successfully disengage. Without the dailies though it can simply turn into a TPK pretty quick.</p><p></p><p>Not that any of this is REALLY fundamentally different from 1e/2e low level play (never did play 3e) where once the wiz and cleric burn their spells things get risky too. I think you have to look at your daily as being like the 'best spell you have' on a low level magic user in 1e. You may have others, but the 'get out of jail free' card is played. Remember, in 4e sometimes even having full dailies isn't enough!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 4710734, member: 82106"] Yeah, for their level kobolds are one of the more troublesome monsters. Shifty really does cause people a lot of trouble! lol. 4e is a LOT more tactical than earlier editions. In some ways that's good, but it can be troublesome for a group of players that are used to sort of just 'pressing the buttons' on their characters in combat. It also relies a LOT more on combining the actions of different characters together to make you effective. It may be that your party hasn't yet figured out the best way to do that, and/or some of the players just aren't of that mindset. Personally I think they may have overdone it a bit, it can be pretty hard to play 4e if you just aren't interested in or particularly talented at tactics. As for the problem of going on without dailies. It CAN be a problem. You could run into 2-3 ordinary difficulty encounters and have no problems. You could even beat some harder encounters with good tactics and maybe a bit of luck without expending dailies. The real problem comes when you get into that crunch encounter where around 4-5 rounds in you start to realize you're in over your head. Normally you'd burn your dailies, an AP, an encounter power, and either cut the enemy down to size quick or create a situation where you can successfully disengage. Without the dailies though it can simply turn into a TPK pretty quick. Not that any of this is REALLY fundamentally different from 1e/2e low level play (never did play 3e) where once the wiz and cleric burn their spells things get risky too. I think you have to look at your daily as being like the 'best spell you have' on a low level magic user in 1e. You may have others, but the 'get out of jail free' card is played. Remember, in 4e sometimes even having full dailies isn't enough! [/QUOTE]
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