Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 6595011" data-attributes="member: 2011">Are you kidding? One of the best uses of barbed wire is for military applications. 15th century soldiers would have killed to acquire barbed wire.There was a huge need for it pre-1870s, it just couldn't be made with the materials at the time. And yes, people back then were just as smart and imaginative as people today. If they could have figured a way to do this, they would have. Callinicus came up with Greek Fire about 700 AD. Dionysius invented the catapult about 400 BC.So if your claim is that there was no need for barbed wire pre-the mass settling of the western US, then why does your PC know about it? <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/laugh.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing    :lol:" data-shortname=":lol:" /> <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/laugh.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing    :lol:" data-shortname=":lol:" />Holy Crap! You just posted a video of a machine making barbed wire out of modern materials.I guess you showed me. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" />Do you think there was stiff wire, stiff enough to create barbed wire before maybe 1800?  Yes, once one HAS the actual materials, one can make barbed wire by hand at maybe 1 foot a minute. But iron wire is brittle (pre-industrial revolution alloys). It takes special alloys to get strong stiff basically bendable wire for the longer lengths and unbendabe wire for short lengths of barbed wire. Yes, today we have those materials in spades, but 300 years ago, they didn't exist. Metal cable did not exist before 1830.It really sounds like you are going to extremes to try to prove an unprovable point. Your argument is like a group of PCs stranded on a mountaintop and one of the players says "Hey, let's build a hot air balloon and fly away.". <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/laugh.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing    :lol:" data-shortname=":lol:" /> It just wouldn't happen in my game.A box with daggers in it to try to keep the guy down? Sure. But he minimally gets a saving throw to accidently put his hand through it and for some types of creatures (like wild animals), they might just try to lift or break out of the box and stand up even without a save.I'm done with this silly argument. My whole point was none of this, just that a cantrip that doesn't give the restrained and blinded conditions should work without a saving throw. You want a cheap way to restrain foes in your game? Great. Do so. I find it an extreme stretch of the power of cantrips when even first level spells are not this strong (Entangle, Ensnaring Strike, and Web for example get a saving throw and a Strength check to get out), but if your DM is not knowledgeable enough about game balance to allow you to do this at will without a save, have at it. Enjoy your trick. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" /></blockquote>

Verification