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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Simon Collins" data-source="post: 1544174" data-attributes="member: 9860">One of the most interesting takes I've seen in changing magic whilst remaining somewhat within the d20 sytem is the Sympathetic Magic system outlined in Atlas Games' "Occult Lore" sourcebook, which seemed somewhat influenced by the Ars Magica system. This system, to my mind, gave more mystery to magic (since players had to design their own spells), and brought into play several themes that are prevalent in fictional writing:Characters tend to have a specialty type of magicThey need an arcane connection to a target (and there is no range limit on spells once you have this nor any limit to the duration)Magic is performed in a ritual (requiring players to come up with significant symbolism in the spells they design)All this is controlled with what looks like a pretty decent spell point system and, most significantly, magic cannot be cast instantaneously - it takes time to perform the ritual. I've not actually playtested the system myself (I'd be interested to hear from anyone who has) but I suspect the biggest 'problem' with such a system is that spellcasting characters could not become involved in standard combat in terms of spellcasting. Spells would be a non-combat function causing the spellcasting players to sit around twiddling their thumbs during combat and the other players to be looking on whilst the spellcaster prepared their ritual before or after outside of combat.Green Ronin's "Witch's Handbook" by Steve Kenson finds a halfway house between the two issues by offering tempting feats to witch characters to achieve some of the flexibility noted above (e.g. the metamagic feat Sympathetic Spell), which allows the character to cast normal magic (though flashier D&D spells are restricted) and also sympathetic magic (at a price)dependent on need. Other options in the book allow for magic to be tied to the phase of the moon, time of the year, the place where the magic is being cast, and other spellcasters taking part in the ritual. Much of this system was based on ideas first presented in Relics & Rituals, which I don't own, but it received high praise when first released.Another interesting set of ideas comes from Decipher's Lord of the Rings RPG. Despite its many faults, the section giving an introduction to how the GM should handle magic in Middle Earth is truly inspiring for creating the feel of a novel in a game's magic system. It deals with how magic mirrors nature, the issues when using magic as a plot device, the impact of magic on those sensitive to it, and the importance of oaths, curses, fate and prophecy in encouraging players and GMs to bring the feel of the novel into the game. Rules are important, of course, but I believe its equally important that all those playing the game work together to create the feel of a novel if that's what you are attempting to do. And outlining the role of magic in the game world before play begins is a great start to achieving that goal.Hope that helps and is relevant to the original topic.Simon Collins</blockquote>

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