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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JohnSnow" data-source="post: 3896109" data-attributes="member: 32164">Well, I think the thing is there are people who want their magical items. In addition, there are people who want their fighters to have more inherent powers. I don't usually think this is the same group.My only gripe (to the extent that I have one) about inherent powers for fighters has to do with the nature of those powers. I don't know if you've read (or seen) Beowulf, but that's a good example. Beowulf, a high-level fighter, strips off his armor and weapons when fighting Grendel because "it wouldn't be honorable" to take on an unarmed opponent with all his gear. So Beowulf fights Grendel butt-naked and unarmed - and literally beats him to death, finally tearing off Grendel's arm and mortally wounding him.Later in life, he fights a dragon with nothing more than a chain shirt and a dagger. Though the battle costs him his life, he once again wins.I have no problem with fighters who can jump ridiculously high, swim ridiculously fast, strangle dragons to death, or inflict critical injuries without any magic weapons. That's pretty much 'par for the course' when it comes to high-level fighters as far as I'm concerned. A low-level hero may need a silver weapon against a werewolf, but Beowulf can probably just tear it limb from limb with his bare hands.Where magic items need to come in for fighters is to allow them to do things that are outside the realm of their abilities. For instance, water-breathing or something that allows the character to fly should be a magic item. Against a flying dragon, a hero like Beowulf can either jump on top of it, brings it to the ground, or shoots or throws weapons at it.The nice part about things like this is they're predominantly plot-based items. So at low levels, the DM can grant the PC a potion to give him that ability for a single adventure or even a single encounter. Items like that are "cool."Now, I wouldn't mind a high-level fighter being able to hold his breath for a ridiculous amount of time. While there might not be an effective difference between being able to breathe water for an hour and being able to hold your breath for the same amount of time, there's a huge flavor difference.I guess what I'm trying to say is that it's as much about "feel" as it is about the actual "power" of the ability. At least for me.Make sense?</blockquote>

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