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<blockquote data-quote="Hammerhead" data-source="post: 265635" data-attributes="member: 73">Actually, the barbarian will probably have more HP than the fighter, but that's really too fine a point since both classes are functionally the same in terms of magic ability.It's a stupid or very unlucky mage who lets an enemy grapple him.&nbsp; It's kind of hard to grapple invisible or incorporeal people.&nbsp; And the mage could just use summoned creatures as cannon fodder.&nbsp; However, if the only point of the fighter is to act as a meat shield for the mage, then is the game really balanced?I think a fully buffed cleric would exceed the unbuffed fighter.&nbsp; I do agree that teamwork is very important.&nbsp; When playing a cleric, I do buff the other characters with GMWs and strength spells.&nbsp; And they help quite a bit.&nbsp; However, the fighter still needs items of his own.&nbsp; Sometimes you won't have time to buff up, some creatures will end up dispelling your effects, and lots of spells work better if you start them on someone decent.&nbsp; There's a big difference between casting casting GMW on a masterwork weapon and casting it on a +1 Holy, Flaming weapon.&nbsp; In the later case, the fighter will do lots more damage on each hit.Sure, adventuring is a team sport.&nbsp; But I'd rather have someone who is good by himself, and better on a team than someone who is good on the team, but also completely dependent on it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hammerhead, post: 265635, member: 73"] Actually, the barbarian will probably have more HP than the fighter, but that's really too fine a point since both classes are functionally the same in terms of magic ability. It's a stupid or very unlucky mage who lets an enemy grapple him. It's kind of hard to grapple invisible or incorporeal people. And the mage could just use summoned creatures as cannon fodder. However, if the only point of the fighter is to act as a meat shield for the mage, then is the game really balanced? I think a fully buffed cleric would exceed the unbuffed fighter. I do agree that teamwork is very important. When playing a cleric, I do buff the other characters with GMWs and strength spells. And they help quite a bit. However, the fighter still needs items of his own. Sometimes you won't have time to buff up, some creatures will end up dispelling your effects, and lots of spells work better if you start them on someone decent. There's a big difference between casting casting GMW on a masterwork weapon and casting it on a +1 Holy, Flaming weapon. In the later case, the fighter will do lots more damage on each hit. Sure, adventuring is a team sport. But I'd rather have someone who is good by himself, and better on a team than someone who is good on the team, but also completely dependent on it. [/QUOTE]

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