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Magus: "Staying the Course"
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<blockquote data-quote="pawsplay" data-source="post: 5332800" data-attributes="member: 15538"><p>So, the word from Paizo is that they will be staying the course on several Magus issues. I'm starting a thread here to ruminate, basicaly because their playtest board is a no-ruminating zone and also because they've been locking threads that suggest changes they have ruled out (like changing the class name). I can appreciate they are not interested in certain kinds of feedback unhelpful to their goals, but I wish the Magus was in a more flexible state of being right now. A few things that I wish would change:</p><p></p><p>1. One-handed weapons</p><p></p><p>No quarterstaves, no glaives. This just makes me kind of sad. Although they can sort of do it by changing grips all the time, these weapons are not compatible with Spell Combat, their signature thing. I see this as unnecessary restrictive, as all they need to is redefine spell combat as letting the weapon count as an empty hand and defining the attack portion to rule out TWF (which I think it already does). For that matter.... isn't a TWF fighter-mage kind of a cool image? Alas, it is not to be.</p><p></p><p>2. Low offense</p><p></p><p>Medium BAB, very few bonuses to hit. Other than casting self-buffs, and a 3rd level option that snags some insight bonuses, this class is pretty light on bonuses-to-hit. Compared to clerics and psychic warriors, who self-buff, and monks and rogues who avoid penalties on their attacks, the magus is pretty hampered. I'm afraid the magus is repeating the sad mistake of the soulknife: a medium BAB class who gets "free gold" as an offensive buff. </p><p></p><p>3. The name</p><p></p><p>For the love of all that is holy, you don't name a fighter-mage after Three Wise Men. Has anyone noticed that Magus is the root word of, oh, MAGE? Magic, magician? That is has been used in D&D previously to mean a high level magic-user? That numerous prestige classes already include the word mage or magus to mean a dedicated caster?</p><p></p><p>4. Concept or ability?</p><p></p><p>Seriously. Being able to cast spells while fighting is an ability, not a concept. For evidence, consider that the Eldritch Knight can do it, simply by taking Combat Casting and Quicken Spell. The Havoc Mage did it better. </p><p></p><p>Why This Is Important</p><p></p><p>It's easy to look back with rose-colored classes, but here's the thing. I don't remember this level of criticism about the APG classes. I really feel like the magus playtest is half-baked. I don't think, in its present form, it's going to make or keep people happy. I don't think the name will wear well over time. It's probably going to languish in CharOp Hell as a weak class, until someone figures out a way to exploit Spell Combat to kill the Tarasque with a quadruple Wraithstrike Time Stop Double Fudge Whammy. </p><p></p><p>It's doubtful that this thread will make any real impact on decisions. However, if the Magus is published without substantial changes, I hope this thread will serve as a monument for future designers to gravely gaze upon. I think Paizo has done a really smashing job with Pathfinder so far, I would hate for something so clumsy as this design to mar their brand.</p><p></p><p>Thoughts?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pawsplay, post: 5332800, member: 15538"] So, the word from Paizo is that they will be staying the course on several Magus issues. I'm starting a thread here to ruminate, basicaly because their playtest board is a no-ruminating zone and also because they've been locking threads that suggest changes they have ruled out (like changing the class name). I can appreciate they are not interested in certain kinds of feedback unhelpful to their goals, but I wish the Magus was in a more flexible state of being right now. A few things that I wish would change: 1. One-handed weapons No quarterstaves, no glaives. This just makes me kind of sad. Although they can sort of do it by changing grips all the time, these weapons are not compatible with Spell Combat, their signature thing. I see this as unnecessary restrictive, as all they need to is redefine spell combat as letting the weapon count as an empty hand and defining the attack portion to rule out TWF (which I think it already does). For that matter.... isn't a TWF fighter-mage kind of a cool image? Alas, it is not to be. 2. Low offense Medium BAB, very few bonuses to hit. Other than casting self-buffs, and a 3rd level option that snags some insight bonuses, this class is pretty light on bonuses-to-hit. Compared to clerics and psychic warriors, who self-buff, and monks and rogues who avoid penalties on their attacks, the magus is pretty hampered. I'm afraid the magus is repeating the sad mistake of the soulknife: a medium BAB class who gets "free gold" as an offensive buff. 3. The name For the love of all that is holy, you don't name a fighter-mage after Three Wise Men. Has anyone noticed that Magus is the root word of, oh, MAGE? Magic, magician? That is has been used in D&D previously to mean a high level magic-user? That numerous prestige classes already include the word mage or magus to mean a dedicated caster? 4. Concept or ability? Seriously. Being able to cast spells while fighting is an ability, not a concept. For evidence, consider that the Eldritch Knight can do it, simply by taking Combat Casting and Quicken Spell. The Havoc Mage did it better. Why This Is Important It's easy to look back with rose-colored classes, but here's the thing. I don't remember this level of criticism about the APG classes. I really feel like the magus playtest is half-baked. I don't think, in its present form, it's going to make or keep people happy. I don't think the name will wear well over time. It's probably going to languish in CharOp Hell as a weak class, until someone figures out a way to exploit Spell Combat to kill the Tarasque with a quadruple Wraithstrike Time Stop Double Fudge Whammy. It's doubtful that this thread will make any real impact on decisions. However, if the Magus is published without substantial changes, I hope this thread will serve as a monument for future designers to gravely gaze upon. I think Paizo has done a really smashing job with Pathfinder so far, I would hate for something so clumsy as this design to mar their brand. Thoughts? [/QUOTE]
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Magus: "Staying the Course"
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