Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Make Tome Warlocks more versital casters?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ClaytonCross" data-source="post: 7413124" data-attributes="member: 6880599"><p>I can completely see this making the class more bearable however.... There is nothing about first few levels or the sub classes that indicate that is the intent. The warlock by name and by its focus on spell slots, spell casting abilities like Mysitic Arcaneum, as well as the large number of Eldritch Invocations on based on spells tell the player that this is a caster class. The sub classes are very clearly designed as arcane melee, scout by proxy, and improved caster versatility. The class also lacks the skill proficiency to be an effective "ranger" focusing on social manipulation and arcana instead. So while I don't disagree with your statement, I feel like players taking warlock for the first time are mislead on what to expect and how to play the class. I would say that the Pact of the Chain is arguably the most suited to your line of though as the scouting abilities come from your familiar which of many I am sure is the "fey spirit imp" with decent perception, invisibility, and devils sight which leaves a lot of room for the warlock to build an "archer with a pet, ranger type" with some social abilities and fun invocations. Pact of the blade has enough evocations since Zanthar's to make if functional as burst sudo paladin <u>in my opinion</u> which makes the need for eldritch blast almost void which is in direct opposition of your warlocks as archers unless your taking improved pact weapon to make you pact weapon a bow, then it comes back around. Tome however, looks like a flexible caster subclass then ends up being the "archer" you speak of by giving you false choices, because 3 cantrips from any class makes you go wow I can do all sorts of .... wait I can only find 3 or 4 cantrips even worth choosing from that I don't already get... well at least I a have tome of ancient secrets and I can get all those rituals...but almost all of the good ones are wizard and it requires that your GM provides scrolls and you don't have a wizard in your group taking them all. If your GM uses random roll tables for all magic drops the book of ancient secrets becomes random as to whether it will be useful in the campaign at all. So yes as a tome you end up being and "eldritch archer" while everything about the class tells you you could be a Warlock calling on the powers of magic granted from your patron to be a spell caster like a cleric with a different system as you might consider a sorcerer a different system for wizard. </p><p></p><p>I just feel like the Tome warlocks don't get any dependable self reliant abilities that let them live up to what the sell them selves as. Even a few good Tome only eldritch invocations thought could fix that. Though I don't know exactly what those might be. An extra pact slot would be good and I really like the invocation I wrote for mystic Araucanian but I feel like smarter poeple could makes something better. Maybe even "at will" invocations for higher level spells that are tome only.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ClaytonCross, post: 7413124, member: 6880599"] I can completely see this making the class more bearable however.... There is nothing about first few levels or the sub classes that indicate that is the intent. The warlock by name and by its focus on spell slots, spell casting abilities like Mysitic Arcaneum, as well as the large number of Eldritch Invocations on based on spells tell the player that this is a caster class. The sub classes are very clearly designed as arcane melee, scout by proxy, and improved caster versatility. The class also lacks the skill proficiency to be an effective "ranger" focusing on social manipulation and arcana instead. So while I don't disagree with your statement, I feel like players taking warlock for the first time are mislead on what to expect and how to play the class. I would say that the Pact of the Chain is arguably the most suited to your line of though as the scouting abilities come from your familiar which of many I am sure is the "fey spirit imp" with decent perception, invisibility, and devils sight which leaves a lot of room for the warlock to build an "archer with a pet, ranger type" with some social abilities and fun invocations. Pact of the blade has enough evocations since Zanthar's to make if functional as burst sudo paladin [U]in my opinion[/U] which makes the need for eldritch blast almost void which is in direct opposition of your warlocks as archers unless your taking improved pact weapon to make you pact weapon a bow, then it comes back around. Tome however, looks like a flexible caster subclass then ends up being the "archer" you speak of by giving you false choices, because 3 cantrips from any class makes you go wow I can do all sorts of .... wait I can only find 3 or 4 cantrips even worth choosing from that I don't already get... well at least I a have tome of ancient secrets and I can get all those rituals...but almost all of the good ones are wizard and it requires that your GM provides scrolls and you don't have a wizard in your group taking them all. If your GM uses random roll tables for all magic drops the book of ancient secrets becomes random as to whether it will be useful in the campaign at all. So yes as a tome you end up being and "eldritch archer" while everything about the class tells you you could be a Warlock calling on the powers of magic granted from your patron to be a spell caster like a cleric with a different system as you might consider a sorcerer a different system for wizard. I just feel like the Tome warlocks don't get any dependable self reliant abilities that let them live up to what the sell them selves as. Even a few good Tome only eldritch invocations thought could fix that. Though I don't know exactly what those might be. An extra pact slot would be good and I really like the invocation I wrote for mystic Araucanian but I feel like smarter poeple could makes something better. Maybe even "at will" invocations for higher level spells that are tome only. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Make Tome Warlocks more versital casters?
Top