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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 7402722" data-attributes="member: 7006">If we are assuming for the sake of this thread the following two points are true and are unwanted:- Players are less likely to create a race/class combo when the race's benefits do not help the class.- Players will advance their primary stat to 20 first and foremost and thus every PC is the &quot;best&quot; at that thing.How can you &quot;solve&quot; this unwanted state?&nbsp; And I'm going to ignore for the moment the idea that every PC having a 20 in their primary stat might actually be okay-- for the sake of argument in this thread we'll say that it's not.For the first point... the unselected race/class combos... the simplest solution is to just not give different races different bonuses to ability scores.&nbsp; Take away the +2/+1 for each of the demihuman races and the +1 to six from the humans... and just start everyone based upon their rolled scores or standard/point buy arrays.&nbsp; At that point there still might be a little bit of self-selection of class based upon the other racial features (so for instance players might still prioritize Dex/Stealth for their Wood Elves because they have Mask of the Wild)... but it does widen the possibility of other ability prioritization.&nbsp; You might find more players who make Strong wood elves for instance.Then for the second point, the easiest way to make sure PCs do not all max out their primary ability score is to just remove all ASIs.&nbsp; There's no necessity to having PCs see their ability scores get better.&nbsp; The game can and does function fine without them.&nbsp; And in fact... if you don't have ability score increases, it makes those things that DO increase the functionality of those effects which use them even more important.&nbsp; If you don't have ASIs... finding a magic weapon or Gauntlets of ogre power might be the only time besides the rise of your prof bonus where you'll see your permanent Attack Bonus and Damage go up over the course of your PCs life.&nbsp; If you've been stuck at a +6 for many levels (for example)... finding that +1 sword to finally move up to a +7 might be a big deal.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 7402722, member: 7006"] If we are assuming for the sake of this thread the following two points are true and are unwanted: - Players are less likely to create a race/class combo when the race's benefits do not help the class. - Players will advance their primary stat to 20 first and foremost and thus [B]every[/B] PC is the "best" at that thing. How can you "solve" this unwanted state? And I'm going to ignore for the moment the idea that every PC having a 20 in their primary stat might actually be okay-- for the sake of argument in this thread we'll say that it's not. For the first point... the unselected race/class combos... the simplest solution is to just not give different races different bonuses to ability scores. Take away the +2/+1 for each of the demihuman races and the +1 to six from the humans... and just start everyone based upon their rolled scores or standard/point buy arrays. At that point there still might be a [I]little[/I] bit of self-selection of class based upon the other racial features (so for instance players might still prioritize Dex/Stealth for their Wood Elves because they have Mask of the Wild)... but it does widen the possibility of other ability prioritization. You might find more players who make Strong wood elves for instance. Then for the second point, the easiest way to make sure PCs do not all max out their primary ability score is to just remove all ASIs. There's no necessity to having PCs see their ability scores get better. The game can and does function fine without them. And in fact... if you don't have ability score increases, it makes those things that DO increase the functionality of those effects which use them even more important. If you don't have ASIs... finding a magic weapon or Gauntlets of ogre power might be the only time besides the rise of your prof bonus where you'll see your permanent Attack Bonus and Damage go up over the course of your PCs life. If you've been stuck at a +6 for many levels (for example)... finding that +1 sword to finally move up to a +7 might be a big deal. [/QUOTE]

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