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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ahglock" data-source="post: 4585685" data-attributes="member: 56725">sure and a lot of those reasons were really bad, and the new rules end up making the game lame in the other direction.I have no desire to see rituals happening in rounds, but the 10 minute baseline for most rituals I find to be overboard in the extreme.  A couple minutes tops for the vast majority of rituals would remove them from combat and not be any more unbalanced than 10+ minutes.  And no short rests being 5 minutes does not make a difference.  You have 1 question when dealing with time for short rests.  Do they have enough time for a short rest or not.  If no, it does not really matter you probably wont finish a short ritual and you wont get the short rest.     If yes, really the question is am I giving them enough time to get to full health and do what they want or not.  Once you are giving multiple short rest periods its not like there DMs are usually giving specific times before something happens like 13 minutes, its just enough time to do X or not enough time to do X.   And however much stuff you are getting done, a rituasl of any length puts you in a slower short rest period than the rest of the party, so the DM can aways still put the ritual caster at some kind of penalty, by either interupting the ritual or by giving no or less rest periods.   At the 1 rest level the person is then making a decision short rest or ritual.  At the multiple rest level you are really saying, I am letting the party get all the stuff done they want.  And really that is all the balnce you need. And side note the costs in gold has crossed the border of absurd on quite a few rituals.</blockquote>

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