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<blockquote data-quote="cmbarona" data-source="post: 4975445" data-attributes="member: 71281">A quick question from the DMs perspective. When designing encounters, I like to challenge my players. I notice that the standard encounter (Level=N) is a bit of a pushover for experienced players, so I'd like to create a bigger challenge for them. However, I'm worried about taking this to an extreme.To give a little background:I play in a game where the DM frequently uses the standard encounter XP budget, and in his old 3.5 fashion, frequently uses a series of lower-level standard monsters in order to fill out the encounter. What ends up happening from a player's perspective is that they are more of a nuisance than a challenge.At the same time, I recently tried to challenge my group and made them face a series of level N+3 opponents and the Ranger ended up griping the whole time because it was so difficult for him to hit (to his benefit, I didn't plan well for the enemies' AC and to-hit reducing abilities). My bad, time to learn from my mistake.So... advice? Should I keep higher-level opponents and just keep a closer eye on the inherent math? Or should I use same-level monsters but throw more of them at the players? What are the benefits and/or complications of each approach?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="cmbarona, post: 4975445, member: 71281"] A quick question from the DMs perspective. When designing encounters, I like to challenge my players. I notice that the standard encounter (Level=N) is a bit of a pushover for experienced players, so I'd like to create a bigger challenge for them. However, I'm worried about taking this to an extreme. To give a little background: I play in a game where the DM frequently uses the standard encounter XP budget, and in his old 3.5 fashion, frequently uses a series of lower-level standard monsters in order to fill out the encounter. What ends up happening from a player's perspective is that they are more of a nuisance than a challenge. At the same time, I recently tried to challenge my group and made them face a series of level N+3 opponents and the Ranger ended up griping the whole time because it was so difficult for him to hit (to his benefit, I didn't plan well for the enemies' AC and to-hit reducing abilities). My bad, time to learn from my mistake. So... advice? Should I keep higher-level opponents and just keep a closer eye on the inherent math? Or should I use same-level monsters but throw more of them at the players? What are the benefits and/or complications of each approach? [/QUOTE]

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