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Making guns palatable in high fantasy [Design Theory]
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<blockquote data-quote="(Psi)SeveredHead" data-source="post: 5762128" data-attributes="member: 1165"><p>D&D gains non-magic ranged attacks. (Insert something about Robin Hood, Legolas, etc. Not that said archetypes are cooler than a gunslinger, but more fit medieval fantasy.)</p><p></p><p>It's an expectations game. It doesn't matter that a sword, axe or a crossbow is lethal, many people just won't accept them being as deadly as guns in-game or capable of "going through armor". We're more familiar with people being shot at than being chopped at with machetes.</p><p></p><p>Also, for whatever reason, people want guns to be realistic, in a game system where no form of combat is. People will accept that a 20th-level ranger can walk around with his bow strung all day, even in the rain, then fire off four aimed shots in less than six seconds, despite the need to restring the bow, use wax, etc, as we're not familiar with shooting longbows, and even those of us who are usually use modern "easy" bows that require less maintenance, less strength and aren't actually used to kill people. People will accept that a crossbow can be reloaded, aimed and fired in less than six seconds (I believe a light crossbow can be reloaded as a move action in 3.x)... I don't know if that's possible and frankly I don't care. It's a game. But the moment you bring out guns there's talk of caliber, foot-pounds, muzzle velocities, temporary wound channels, permanent wound channels, hydrostatic shock, model (matchlock vs arquebus, or are those the same thing?), the ability to dodge "triggers" or run zig zag patterns vs the inability to actually outrun a bullet, ease of use versus longbows, rate of fire, recoil, smoke causing concealment, pinning fire, whether you aim in small squad combat versus shooting at a massive block of opponents you can barely see, gun expense, bullet expense, how they compare to magic, what year and what country/empire/state used which weapons when, high crits, special armor-penetration rules, wet powder (deep breath) all impinging on game balance, flavor, understanding <em>and</em> fun.</p><p></p><p>Even the seemingly simple strategy of having guns being a single "one-blast" thing doesn't work. You could argue that spending a feat to be able to use a gun, which is just a single powerful shot you can use once per encounter, is balanced. PCs will do what people have done for hundreds of years - get multiple guns and hang them from their hips. Of course, you could nerf guns, in which case why bother going to all this trouble?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="(Psi)SeveredHead, post: 5762128, member: 1165"] D&D gains non-magic ranged attacks. (Insert something about Robin Hood, Legolas, etc. Not that said archetypes are cooler than a gunslinger, but more fit medieval fantasy.) It's an expectations game. It doesn't matter that a sword, axe or a crossbow is lethal, many people just won't accept them being as deadly as guns in-game or capable of "going through armor". We're more familiar with people being shot at than being chopped at with machetes. Also, for whatever reason, people want guns to be realistic, in a game system where no form of combat is. People will accept that a 20th-level ranger can walk around with his bow strung all day, even in the rain, then fire off four aimed shots in less than six seconds, despite the need to restring the bow, use wax, etc, as we're not familiar with shooting longbows, and even those of us who are usually use modern "easy" bows that require less maintenance, less strength and aren't actually used to kill people. People will accept that a crossbow can be reloaded, aimed and fired in less than six seconds (I believe a light crossbow can be reloaded as a move action in 3.x)... I don't know if that's possible and frankly I don't care. It's a game. But the moment you bring out guns there's talk of caliber, foot-pounds, muzzle velocities, temporary wound channels, permanent wound channels, hydrostatic shock, model (matchlock vs arquebus, or are those the same thing?), the ability to dodge "triggers" or run zig zag patterns vs the inability to actually outrun a bullet, ease of use versus longbows, rate of fire, recoil, smoke causing concealment, pinning fire, whether you aim in small squad combat versus shooting at a massive block of opponents you can barely see, gun expense, bullet expense, how they compare to magic, what year and what country/empire/state used which weapons when, high crits, special armor-penetration rules, wet powder (deep breath) all impinging on game balance, flavor, understanding [i]and[/i] fun. Even the seemingly simple strategy of having guns being a single "one-blast" thing doesn't work. You could argue that spending a feat to be able to use a gun, which is just a single powerful shot you can use once per encounter, is balanced. PCs will do what people have done for hundreds of years - get multiple guns and hang them from their hips. Of course, you could nerf guns, in which case why bother going to all this trouble? [/QUOTE]
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