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<blockquote data-quote="mmadsen" data-source="post: 5769329" data-attributes="member: 1645">I wouldn't claim that there is exactly one complaint against guns in D&amp;D.&nbsp; Certainly many people don't want guns in their Tolkien-esque high-fantasy game or even in their Howard-esque sword &amp; sorcery game -- while others do want guns in their Burroughs-esque sword &amp; planet game or their Heavy Metal-esque post-apocalyptic game.If you haven't heard anyone complain about how guns are &quot;unrealistic&quot; in D&amp;D, perhaps you have noticed how many people want house rules to make them more lethal, to make them bypass armor, etc.&nbsp; Those rules may or may not be a good idea, but certainly many people find something off-putting about how D&amp;D handles guns.The complaints aren't purely against guns though, because they're often about, say, city guards with crossbows who got the drop on a high-level PC, where the crossbows are a quasi-medieval stand-in for guns -- and the high-level PC is not the least bit scared of taking a few crossbow bolts.You're quite welcome, [MENTION=6675228]Hassassin[/MENTION].I haven't been making a recommendation for how to handle firearms in D&amp;D.&nbsp; Or, rather, my recommendation has been to handle them just like crossbows and to accept that they don't feel like guns much of the time.If we were starting from scratch, and we wanted to make firearms no more lethal than they currently are yet dangerous from the very first shot, we could give them a small chance of killing (or disabling) their target with each hit instead of knocking down the target's hit point total.Since gamers who have grown up with D&amp;D-style hit points often have trouble grasping a weapon that isn't especially lethal but can kill with one shot, let's imagine a small-caliber pistol with a 1-in-20 chance of killing its target.&nbsp; Does it generally kill its target on the first shot?&nbsp; No, not even close.&nbsp; Would you be scared to take a single shot from it?&nbsp; Yes, definitely.&nbsp; How many shots does it typically take to drop someone?&nbsp; There isn't a good answer for that, because the distribution isn't clustered around a single mean, median, and mode.&nbsp; Half the time the target survives 13 shots before succumbing, but the average number of shots needed to drop a target is 20, and each shot is equally likely to finish the job.It's just a different way of modeling damage.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="mmadsen, post: 5769329, member: 1645"] I wouldn't claim that there is exactly one complaint against guns in D&D. Certainly many people don't want guns in their Tolkien-esque high-fantasy game or even in their Howard-esque sword & sorcery game -- while others [i]do[/i] want guns in their Burroughs-esque sword & planet game or their [i]Heavy Metal[/i]-esque post-apocalyptic game. If you haven't heard anyone complain about how guns are "unrealistic" in D&D, perhaps you have noticed how many people want house rules to make them more lethal, to make them bypass armor, etc. Those rules may or may not be a good idea, but certainly many people find something off-putting about how D&D handles guns. The complaints aren't [i]purely[/i] against guns though, because they're often about, say, city guards with crossbows who got the drop on a high-level PC, where the crossbows are a quasi-medieval stand-in for guns -- and the high-level PC is not the least bit scared of taking a few crossbow bolts. You're quite welcome, [MENTION=6675228]Hassassin[/MENTION]. I haven't been making a recommendation for how to handle firearms in D&D. Or, rather, my recommendation has been to handle them just like crossbows and to accept that they don't feel like guns much of the time. If we were starting from scratch, and we wanted to make firearms no more lethal than they currently are yet dangerous from the very first shot, we could give them a small chance of killing (or disabling) their target with each hit instead of knocking down the target's hit point total. Since gamers who have grown up with D&D-style hit points often have trouble grasping a weapon that isn't especially lethal but can kill with one shot, let's imagine a small-caliber pistol with a 1-in-20 chance of killing its target. Does it generally kill its target on the first shot? No, not even close. Would you be scared to take a single shot from it? Yes, definitely. How many shots does it typically take to drop someone? There isn't a good answer for that, because the distribution isn't clustered around a single mean, median, and mode. Half the time the target survives 13 shots before succumbing, but the average number of shots needed to drop a target is 20, and each shot is equally likely to finish the job. It's just a different way of modeling damage. [/QUOTE]

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