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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pming" data-source="post: 7054827" data-attributes="member: 45197">Hiya!I'm not going to presume what both @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6871450" target="_blank">Wulffolk</a> and @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=20564" target="_blank">Blue</a> would say on this reply, but for me...But what about "square 2"? When the players forgot to write down the colour of the flower that some little girl that delivered a message to the PC's as they walked down the street a few days ago, and some other detail? If I, as DM (obviously) describe the girl as "A cute little human girl, maybe 10 years of age with long, blond, braided hair with a yellow flower in it. She wears a plain brown dress, but with a thin blue trim along the bottom. She smiles and you can tell she is happy by the look in her big blue eyes. 'Sirs and madames, I was paid a silver coin to deliver this message to you'. She then hands you a small piece of paper and stands there smiling, obviously expecting and answer or something...".  What part of that scene is "important"? Age? Hair colour? Sytle? The blue trimmed dress? The flower? Her eye colour? Unless your players are going to write down every little thing you describe...there could very well come a time when they need to remember some detail.DM: You find yourself brought, tied at the wrists and ankles, before Black Dougal, Master Thief of the Westington City Thieves guild. 'So, you may be assassins. We know you got a message to find this place...but we don't know if it was from one of our members who thought you could help...or if it was by our rivals and you were sent here to kill us. I'll ask you two questions about the girl that delivered it to you. If you get it correct, we know it was from one of our girls...wrong, and we know it was from our rivals little rats! So...the girl was wearing a flower in her hair. What colour was it? Second, her dress...what colour were her short sleeves?" (NOTE: 2nd is a trick question...just her trim on the dress was blue... thieves and assassins are tricksey that way! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ).THIS is where an "Int check" would come into play. I'm not sure about your game, but in mine, as I said, I don't point out the "important" information about most things...especially if they would be seen as "regular, everyday stuff' that the PC's would encounter. So while I do expect my players to make copious notes about what they think is important...they can't write down everything, and they can't remember everything themselves (especially if it happened two or three sessions ago). This is where I use Int saves/checks. And, as you may have guessed, it happens about as frequently as many other skill checks.This was directed at Blue, but I'll just add in my own 2¢. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> I don't think his interpretation or use of Int in this way is inappropriate at all, and certainly no reason to just up and leave the game. At least not any more so than a player saying "I'll hold the door while Bill can get the potions out!"...and the DM saying "Uh, you're a gnome with a 6 strength... I don't think you have much of a chance to hold the door closed on an ogre. But...go ahead and make a Str Save against what the Ogre gets for Athletics/Strength....". If you would 'up and leave' if the DM asked you to do that, well, uh, I don't know what to say. A DM asking a player to make an Int save for his Int 6 character to come up with a complicated plan involving timing, motion, predictive movement/tactics, etc., really isn't any difference from my point of view. *shrug* Luckily for me, my players RP their characters pretty well overall, so I rarely have to do this kind of thing; they'll just come up with 'stupid' or completely impractical plans if their character has a low Int or Wis...and watching them play a character with a really low Cha is both amazing, and cringe-worthy! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />^_^Paul L. Ming</blockquote>

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