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<blockquote data-quote="Artoomis" data-source="post: 1428932" data-attributes="member: 111">I came up with this over in House Rules.&nbsp; Note that it is powerful in that you get permanent effects, but you pay the same experience cost as with slotless wondrous items and you burn a feat that only lets you do certain spells.&nbsp; So instead of slotelss items that can (rarely) be destroyed, you get permanent spells that are tough to lose, but with a very restricted list.PERMANENT PERMANENCYPrerequisites:&nbsp; Ability to cast Permanency; ability to cast 7th level arcane spells (including the use of Miracle to cast 7th level arcane spells).Benefit: Whenever a spell that was made permanent upon the caster's person would otherwise end due to a dispel effect, the magic is instead only suppressed for 1d4 rounds.&nbsp; This benefit only applies to spells the caster has done himself, and only to those spells made permanent after taking this feat.&nbsp; In addition, these permanent spells are treated as items for the purposes of eliminating them so that, for example, they get a Will save vs. Mage’s Disjunction.&nbsp; Finally, the experience cost table is replaced by the table below:[code]Spell Name&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; New XP CostArcane sight&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5,000Comprehend languages&nbsp; &nbsp; 250Darkvision&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000Detect magic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 200Read magic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 150See invisibility&nbsp; &nbsp; 2,000Tongues&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4,000Enlarge person&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 350Magic fang&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 350Magic fang, greater&nbsp; &nbsp; 2,500Reduce person&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 350Resistance&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 200[/code]Normal: Permanent spells are subject to being dispelled by any caster one level higher than the caster level when created, and they are automatically disjoined just as any other spell would be.&nbsp; Note that Telepathic Bond must be cast upon two creatures, and so in ineligible for this feat.The below is a comparison of experience point cost of a slotless wondrous item (use activated or continuous) to Permanency’s cost.XP = Spell Level x Caster Level x 2,000 x Duration Modifier x 2 (Slotless Modifier)/25[code]Spell Name&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Item Experience Point Formula&nbsp; &nbsp; Item XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Perm XPArcane sight&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (3 x 5 x 2,000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 4,800 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; 1,500 XPComprehend languages&nbsp; &nbsp; (1 x 1 x 2000 x 1.5 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 240 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPDarkvision&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (2 x 3 x 2000 x 1 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 960 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000 XPDetect magic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 160 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPRead magic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 1.5 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 120 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPSee invisibility&nbsp; &nbsp; (2 x 3 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 2000 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000 XPTongues&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (3 x 5 x 2000 x 1.5 x2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 3,600 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; 1,500 XPEnlarge person&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 320 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPMagic fang&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 320 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPMagic fang, greater&nbsp; &nbsp; (3 x 5 x 2000 x 1 x2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 2,400 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; 1,500 XPReduce person&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 320 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XPResistance&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25&nbsp; &nbsp; 160 XP&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 500 XP[/code]That's a fascinating table.&nbsp; I assumed that all are double price for slotless and are &quot;always on&quot; (as opposed to &quot;use activated,&quot; which would have no duration modifier) and applied the appropriate spell duration modifier.That table is how I derived the new costs.&nbsp; As a side note, it shows how screwed up the table is in the book.&nbsp; I'd say regular Permanacy cost should be perhaps 1/4 of a permanent item - since at high levels they will be routinely dispelled - you can count on it.&nbsp; High levels battles often start with Greater Dispel Magic spells going off on both sides.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Artoomis, post: 1428932, member: 111"] I came up with this over in House Rules. Note that it is powerful in that you get permanent effects, but you pay the same experience cost as with slotless wondrous items and you burn a feat that only lets you do certain spells. So instead of slotelss items that can (rarely) be destroyed, you get permanent spells that are tough to lose, but with a very restricted list. [B]PERMANENT PERMANENCY[/B] [B]Prerequisites:[/B] Ability to cast Permanency; ability to cast 7th level arcane spells (including the use of Miracle to cast 7th level arcane spells). [B]Benefit: [/B] Whenever a spell that was made permanent upon the caster's person would otherwise end due to a dispel effect, the magic is instead only suppressed for 1d4 rounds. This benefit only applies to spells the caster has done himself, and only to those spells made permanent after taking this feat. In addition, these permanent spells are treated as items for the purposes of eliminating them so that, for example, they get a Will save vs. Mage’s Disjunction. Finally, the experience cost table is replaced by the table below: [code]Spell Name New XP Cost Arcane sight 5,000 Comprehend languages 250 Darkvision 1,000 Detect magic 200 Read magic 150 See invisibility 2,000 Tongues 4,000 Enlarge person 350 Magic fang 350 Magic fang, greater 2,500 Reduce person 350 Resistance 200[/code] [B]Normal:[/B] Permanent spells are subject to being dispelled by any caster one level higher than the caster level when created, and they are automatically disjoined just as any other spell would be. Note that Telepathic Bond must be cast upon two creatures, and so in ineligible for this feat. The below is a comparison of experience point cost of a slotless wondrous item (use activated or continuous) to Permanency’s cost. XP = Spell Level x Caster Level x 2,000 x Duration Modifier x 2 (Slotless Modifier)/25 [code] Spell Name Item Experience Point Formula Item XP Perm XP Arcane sight (3 x 5 x 2,000 x 2 x 2)/25 4,800 XP 1,500 XP Comprehend languages (1 x 1 x 2000 x 1.5 x 2)/25 240 XP 500 XP Darkvision (2 x 3 x 2000 x 1 x 2)/25 960 XP 1,000 XP Detect magic (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 160 XP 500 XP Read magic (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 1.5 x 2)/25 120 XP 500 XP See invisibility (2 x 3 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 2000 XP 1,000 XP Tongues (3 x 5 x 2000 x 1.5 x2)/25 3,600 XP 1,500 XP Enlarge person (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 320 XP 500 XP Magic fang (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 320 XP 500 XP Magic fang, greater (3 x 5 x 2000 x 1 x2)/25 2,400 XP 1,500 XP Reduce person (1 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 320 XP 500 XP Resistance (1/2 x 1 x 2000 x 2 x 2)/25 160 XP 500 XP[/code] That's a fascinating table. I assumed that all are double price for slotless and are "always on" (as opposed to "use activated," which would have no duration modifier) and applied the appropriate spell duration modifier. That table is how I derived the new costs. As a side note, it shows how screwed up the table is in the book. I'd say regular Permanacy cost should be perhaps 1/4 of a permanent item - since at high levels they will be routinely dispelled - you can count on it. High levels battles often start with Greater Dispel Magic spells going off on both sides. [/QUOTE]

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