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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6379390" data-attributes="member: 6696971">Putting realism and versimilitude to the side for a moment, I'd like to talk about what the actual in-game dynamic that I'm GMing.  Let us say that I don't want to chew through 6-8 combat encounters per day because the central focus of playing being the tension of resource ablation is not particularly interesting to me.  Let us say that I want that central focus to be themed quests that the players are interested in.  So that is going to include chases, parlays, espionage and other recon, perilous journeys/wilderness exploration, etc.  So let us say that play is modeled upon 5+ conflicts per day.  If I'm going to be in the vicinity of 5 + conflicts, 2+ need (maybe 33 - 40ish %) to be noncombat conflicts of which the resolution legitimately affects and drives the course of play.  So, I'm running this game for a Fighter player and a Wizard player.  Quests and the relevant thematic material and genre tropes that they each want the game to be premised upon have been transparently conveyed.  Now this is just Basic, so I'm not including outrageous spells like Animate Dead, Clone, Contagion, (Turn yourself into a friggin adult red dragon) Polymorph Self (or whatever it is in the PHB), and WIsh.  Further, I'm not going to include the Wizard's own abilities to interface with the task resolution system via the large number of Intelligence and Wisdom based skills.  Let us just say that the 10 nonphysical skills of which Wizards will be adept at or functional at is at least the equivalent of the Fighter's 4-5 physical skills (possibly more if they invest heavily in Wisdom and take Perception and Survival).As we work through the tiers of play, here are the discrete packets of non-negotiable fiat power that the Wizard will have available for noncombat conflicts of which the resolution legitimately affects and drives the course of play. Wizard:* Fool with an illusion* Please a crowd with actual magic or clean up a mess with the most powerful magic from Fantasia (only actually do it!)* Manipulate stuff at range with a telekinetic hand.* Become someone else.* Make friends with folks who don't care to be your friend.* Speak to folks you couldn't speak with otherwise.then* Poof, you're gone as you have one of the most powerful items from LotR at your fingertips.* Locked door?  What locked door?* Gravity is meaningless.* Make folks do stuff for you.[HR][/HR]Tier 2:* No.  I mean gravity is MEANINGLESS.* That giant, that impassable wall, etc is truly there.then * Yeah, I'm pretty much someplace else.* How about Frodo's cloak on steroids?then* Remember that whole free will thing that you had?  Yeah, you don't have it.  Its mine.* Remember those impassable walls that a thousand armies have fallen against?  They mean nothing to me.  That sucks?  Yeah, well I can erect my own so its all good.* Yeah, I can haunt the dreams or render sleepless anyone..in the world.  No worries.then * Well, thieves guild master, the thing is, I know you like your squad of goons.  I get it. They're great.  Its just that, well, I like them better.  So I'm taking them, thank you.* I see everything.  Everything in this world and everything in that world that is layered on top of it.* Me and all of my homies are somewhere else.  Far away.  Right now.  Fun![HR][/HR]Tier 3* Alright, who wants to see into the future today!?  <Memememememeeee> Bobby, Timmy?  No, its Jane's turn today!* Check this out.  My watch is pretty cool.  When I press the button at the top, it stops the hands of the clock from ticking.  And by the clock I mean time.  No real time.  Yeah, I know its pretty awesome.[HR][/HR]Meanwhile, our Fighter friend will be working solely in the afformentioned, bounded accuracy, task resolution system (of which the prospects of failure on medium tasks - eg anything of consequence - are not low).  Throughout the tiers of play he will be performing in noncombat conflicts of which the resolution legitimately affects and drives the course of play in the following ways:* Watch me maybe > probably climb this (as long is it isn't the razorvine covered sort in hell) wall.* Watch me maybe > probably run this thief/bad guy down (as long as he can't fly or disappear).* Watch me maybe > probably jump this (smallish > average > above average) pit.* Watch me swim this moat or maybe > probably swim this rushing river.* Watch me throw over this table and maybe > probably break this mundane object with my bear hands.  Because I'm tough!* Oh I can hang onto a wagon!  Look out!* I can be your pack mule because Encumbrance is serious business, ok?* Watch me maybe > probably drink this guy under the table.* I'll keep watch.  You guys sleep.  I'm good...maybe > probably.  You're good too (assuming I'm Perception trained...and I don't have a mediocre Wisdom modifier). * I'll maybe (assuming I'm Perception trained + I don't have a mediocre Wisdom modifier) get us some food in the wilderness.* I'll maybe (assuming I'm Perception trained +I don't have a mediocre Wisdom modifier) spot some trouble before it spots us.* I'll maybe (assuming I'm Perception trained + I don't have a mediocre Wisdom modifier) successfully track creatures.[HR][/HR]As we all know, the Wizard's payload will progressively become more and more potent.  As is the way of the Quadratic Wizard, with the advancement of tiers and his progression of power, he will just flat-out be playing a different game.  He will anchor (or outright solely propel) the resolution of noncombat conflicts.  His proliferation of means and his specified, non-negotiable tools will utterly outmode the mundane conflicts that the Fighter has any ability to engage with.  Further, the Fighter will only ever have the means to engage with those outmoded-by-way-of-Wizard conflicts as his gameplay never, ever changes.  What's more, the proportion of nonviolent conflicts:violent conflicts (the stuff the Fighter is supposed to be the master of) will skew toward the former as the Wizard attains more robust means to circumvent combat entirely (if not solely propelling, then anchoring the effort to do so).I've GMed tons and tons of mid level, high level, and epic level D&D in every edition.  Outside of 4e, this paradigm (less physical conflicts because Wizard and outmoded mundane conflicts that the Fighter might actually be able to engage in because Wizard) was utterly inescapable, even if every Fighter had a sword that could divine and a magic carpet/flying boots (again, made relevant by way of magic).  And "rulings" don't make that go away.  If anything, every player who has ever come to my table from past games has always had a litany of horror stories from GM rulings underpinned by the GM's notions of "realism" (which inevitably hurts only mundane characters).Nerf the living hell out of spellcasters (mechanically) such that mundane conflicts aren't utterly outmoded or give the Fighters stuff that undoes their noncombat obseletion as the game progresses.  That or live with the inevitable fallout on gameplay.  That is it.  Period.  End of issue.</blockquote>

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