Mass combat

[hong]

Yes, I am mass combating RIGHT NOW, IKYWIMAITYD.

With that out of the way, my PCs are getting to the levels where they can take on fair-sized groups of enemies (say 50-100) with a good chance of success. Needless to say, I'd rather not play out a battle of this size using the standard D&D rules.

What books are out there that have rules to handle big combats? I'm not really looking to simulate a clash of armies. What I want is an easy way to handle individuals taking on hordes of mooks, without having to roll hundreds of dice or move around dozens of counters/minis.

This is a topic that's been rehashed a few times, but I thought it might be good to visit it again.

Ta!

 

[Zerakon]

I can't point you to any books, but since you posted here in house rules, I could offer a house ruley concept for possible exploration.

Since this isn't about armies, but rather facing 50-100 foes, how about a rule where you group up enemies into "gangs" of 4.

1. Make each gang homogoneous, e.g. this gang is composed of four 5th-level monks, these 7 gangs are composed of 2nd-level warriors.

2. Make a gang of small or medium creatures takes up a 10x10 area. A gang of large creatures could take up 15x15 or 20x20, use your judgement based on the creature's body type and weapon usage.

3. Treat a gang's attack as if it was one of its member's attack, so treat the gang of 5th-level monks as a 5th-level monk - it can try for a flurry of blows, stunning fist, whatever, but treat it as if it is a single person attacking, except multiply damage by three.

4. Set a gang's hit points to the hit points of an individual member multiplied by three.

I wouldn't make any spellcaster-gangs, but for grunts, this gang rule or something like it might be good for cutting down the combat dice rolls (by a factor of 4).

 

[Tonguez]

My houserule is

One unit has 100 members

so 100/100 = 1 (Unit Factor)

Factor x CR x Unit Level = Rating
Unit Level is 1 Green 2 Experienced 3 Hardened 4 Veteran 5 Elite

So 50 experienced Ogres
Factor x CR x Level
0.5 x 2 x 2 = 2

This +2 Rating then gets added to the base Ogre BAb and AC and becomes the BAb and AC of the whole 'horde'
Unit HP = 26 (avergae HP) *50 = 1300

So 50 Experienced Ogres
Init -1 AC 18 (16+2) HP 1300
BAb +10 melee (8+2) +3 ranged
Fort +8, Ref +2, Will +3

 

[Tzudralkor]

how do you determine damage? multiply by number in the army, or act as though a single ogre hit? something else?
also, do you reduce combat efficiency as hit points drop? if the 'horde' goes down to 300 HP from1300, it probably wont still have 50 ogres.
do tactics and leadership affect the outcome of a battle? or knowledge of the battlefield? what about communication between commanders?
finally, why multiply CR? the attack and armor are already incorporated into that. you might want to try to find a different factor instead, if you like the current balance.

 

[Tonguez]

1 Okay I first considered using HD as the multiplier but CR is easier and takes into account all factors (yeah including AC etc I know) but I rationalised that a group is more effective than the some of its parts

2 I play the system three ways
1. In a direct roll off of Unit Ratings
2. When the PC is the leader of the Unit use the Horde Stats (eg the BAb +10) as modifiers to a PCs rolls
3. When the Horde has a leader then add the leaders Level to the Unit Rating

3 Morale plays a big part and whenever a unit takes damage it also makes a Will check to keep fighting

4 Also as HP drops I will apply penalties so with HP 300 (about 11 active combatants) I might drop Total Damage to 44 rather than 700 and impose BAb - 5

5 Determining Damage is where the Maths comes in to play first determined:

Total Average Damage = Average Damage X 50
14 x 50 = 700

Next is the Strike Success = ( Unit BAb check - Target AC) x 5 = %
eg Ogre Horde rolls a 14 for an Attack of 14 + 10 =24 vs AC 18

Stike is (24 - 18) x 5 = 30%

Strike Damage = Strike x Total Av.Damage
700 X 30% = 210

So I'd scribble um a quick table like this and take it from there
% Damage
100 - 700
90 - 630
80 - 560
70 - 490
60 - 420
50 - 350
40 - 280
30 - 210
20 - 140
10 - 70
5 - 35