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me finally making the big monk discussion thread
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<blockquote data-quote="Ruin Explorer" data-source="post: 8212010" data-attributes="member: 18"><p>Yeah D&D hit like a bomb in Japan, even though people in the West don't always acknowledge it, and it actually reflected back to us a lot of the imagery that is sort of truly classic - the Tower of Doom Mystara beat'em-up art is almost so D&D it hurts, all the way back in 1994, but even before that a lot of their imagery - especially Dragon Quest was amazing D&D-ish. I remember Dragon Quest didn't really make it to the UK, but I saw in a game mag some concept and cover art from those games, in the very early 1990s, and it just so spot-on for D&D that it was amazing.</p><p></p><p>Re: Arcane Half-Caster I don't think it's quite as simple as a lack of archetype/flavour base. I think, if you look at fantasy literature, there are actually fair number of dabblers, but the thing is, in 1E and 2E, we had multiclassing. And multiclassing (or dual-classing) allowed you to simulate all these dabblers (with the possible exception of Kai/Magnakai but they were like Fighter/Psionicist/Mage). I think because these archetypal dabblers and non-master wizards were all possible to simulate that way, there was zero pressure to make an arcane half-caster. I think were was actually none for a divine half-caster either, it was just that D&D's designers specifically wanted Paladins to be human-only (weirdly), and Rangers to be Aragorn, and thus human (even though he wasn't... dude was 87... half-elf by D&D rules imo), and to not have to dual-class, so they created this divine half-caster concept.</p><p></p><p>Then 3E came out and it was totally retrograde and made a ton of bad decisions re: class design (I'd say it has <em>by far</em> the worst class design of any edition of D&D, from OD&D to 5E - no edition is as unbalanced and yet somehow dull in terms of core classes, and other edition has the PrC system to ruin things further), but we did finally self an arcane half-caster, in the form of the appallingly-designed 3E Bard (which hilariously was still an okay class because of how severe LFQW was), but that was a mess, and yeah, not a concept that should have been a half-caster. 2E's Bard wasn't really a half-caster, it was more like a 3/4 caster, given the rocket-like way it leveled up. I think with Bards you either need a system all their own, or just go with a full caster in a 3E/5E-style casting system.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Ruin Explorer, post: 8212010, member: 18"] Yeah D&D hit like a bomb in Japan, even though people in the West don't always acknowledge it, and it actually reflected back to us a lot of the imagery that is sort of truly classic - the Tower of Doom Mystara beat'em-up art is almost so D&D it hurts, all the way back in 1994, but even before that a lot of their imagery - especially Dragon Quest was amazing D&D-ish. I remember Dragon Quest didn't really make it to the UK, but I saw in a game mag some concept and cover art from those games, in the very early 1990s, and it just so spot-on for D&D that it was amazing. Re: Arcane Half-Caster I don't think it's quite as simple as a lack of archetype/flavour base. I think, if you look at fantasy literature, there are actually fair number of dabblers, but the thing is, in 1E and 2E, we had multiclassing. And multiclassing (or dual-classing) allowed you to simulate all these dabblers (with the possible exception of Kai/Magnakai but they were like Fighter/Psionicist/Mage). I think because these archetypal dabblers and non-master wizards were all possible to simulate that way, there was zero pressure to make an arcane half-caster. I think were was actually none for a divine half-caster either, it was just that D&D's designers specifically wanted Paladins to be human-only (weirdly), and Rangers to be Aragorn, and thus human (even though he wasn't... dude was 87... half-elf by D&D rules imo), and to not have to dual-class, so they created this divine half-caster concept. Then 3E came out and it was totally retrograde and made a ton of bad decisions re: class design (I'd say it has [I]by far[/I] the worst class design of any edition of D&D, from OD&D to 5E - no edition is as unbalanced and yet somehow dull in terms of core classes, and other edition has the PrC system to ruin things further), but we did finally self an arcane half-caster, in the form of the appallingly-designed 3E Bard (which hilariously was still an okay class because of how severe LFQW was), but that was a mess, and yeah, not a concept that should have been a half-caster. 2E's Bard wasn't really a half-caster, it was more like a 3/4 caster, given the rocket-like way it leveled up. I think with Bards you either need a system all their own, or just go with a full caster in a 3E/5E-style casting system. [/QUOTE]
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