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Mearls On D&D's Design Premises/Goals
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<blockquote data-quote="Fallstorm" data-source="post: 7759520" data-attributes="member: 55683"><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">I started D&D in 2E and played every edition since. 4 is my favorite but I like 5E two and I currently am playing in my second 5E campaign. I have DMed but mostly I have been a player. While I like 5E I (along with most of my group) are rather disappointed at the pace of rules production released in 5E. Mike Mearls mentioned that thereis a ton of new players and someone in this over twenty page thread made a statement saying that since 5E is doing so well it must mean that players in general don’t favor heavy rules customization. I take issue with that belief.</span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p> <span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">I take issue with it because we really don’t fully know what Hasbro is counting as sales of D&D. Mike Mearls has said before that they don’t have to put out as many splat books because they can release games like Lords of Waterdeep, etcetera as income generators since the Hasbro merger. I am wondering if things like the numerous board games and additional niche products (Dice sets), etcetera are what is making a more significant portion D&D 5E sales now, whereas the RPG books like splat books were the main revenue generator in previous editions? </span></span><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">I don’t know if there are any hard numbers on this (perhaps [MENTION=1]Morrus[/MENTION] has some insight) but I would feel secure betting that besides the three core books (DMG, PHB, and MM) the biggest book sales of D&D 5E are probably the books that offer actual rules and option expansions like Xanathar’s Guide to Everything and Mordenkainen’s Guide, and also the SCAG (as the first book to really offer PC expansions despite how skimpy). </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">I do know that there are a number of third party options but many people don’t use those because they like to use official products for a variety of reasons: 1) It creates consistency from campaign to campaign and between games 2) people may feel that official splat material has been better play tested, etc. What I think is that is that Mike Mearl’s statement is coming from two places. 1) His own personal philosophy and not that of ALL the designers because I know Jeremy Crawford had written much more crunch to the game that was not included and 2) it was pragmatic political statement. What I mean in regards to the latter is that WOTC only has a handful of game designers compared to the 3E and even early 4E days. It takes a lot to write a book especially a rulebook and with such a small team the pace of production is inevitably going to be impacted. Now, granted I think they can go a little faster (no psionic expansion yet, slow updates on pre-existing game worlds and so forth) but the fact is unless they work around the clock 24/7 they can only do so much—designers have to eat and sleep too.</span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">All that being said again I don’t HATE 5E. Also, I think people being somewhat hyperbolic when they talk about the game being "DM Facing". In 90% of my games I am a player. In 5E my character feels very heroic andempowered. In fact, if the game is played correctly where people the DM is doing level appropriate encounters, PCs are working together, I feel like more of an action hero than I did in 3E (although not as much as in 4E) but still I don’t feel cheated in any way. Likewise while I absolutely crave more rules I do think that there is a sufficient level of crunch in the game between (PHB,Xanathar’s, SCAG, and Mordenkainen’s) there are number of classes, subclasses,races, backgrounds, feats, and even optional rules like downtime activity to play with an interesting number of combinations. </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">Where I think WOTC (Hasbro) maybe harming themselves is that they are losing money on not producing splat material. I am by no means a rich person and what money I have I work hard for. That being said even when D&D is producing volumes of splat materialparticularly in the 2E and 3E days it is a fact that D&D is a VERY economical hobby compared to most other hobbies. Even if 5E came out with a $50 dollar rulebook every month that is PEANUTS compared to golf, poker, attending a sporting event even nosebleed seats, or simply going to a night club and having a few drinks. D&D is still cheaper. I don’t’ play video games but from what I have seen D&D would still not equal the money most avid video gamers spend on their hobby. None of these things I do so I am okay spending my recreation money that I work hard for on a fairly cheap hobby that I enjoy. </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">The problem is with 5E they give very little to spend money on. With 4E and 3.5 even the DM geared material had stuff in it like a bunch of feats,prestige classes/paragon paths/epic destinies geared towards players so I (and my friends) would purchase those books every month. Assuming they came out with just one $40 dollar book a month that is $480 off one person (and I know I spent more than that because 3.5 was sometimes producing more than one splat amonth). On 5E I have spent probablyabout $400 (the total of all my books combined including core) since 2014 when it was released. I don't buy the adventure books and nor does my group. I don't buy them because I don't DM that often and my current DM write most of their own adventures. So despite what Mearls said I think they are losing opportunities by ignoring CharOps people.</span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">The one area where I do think 5E should improve and that they can control but evidently is against design philosophy is in rules clarity. Again, I think 5E is okay from a tactical and combat perspective (I would like to see more tactical options added but I digress) and my character feels powerful enough. It is outside of combat with using abilities and rules that is the issue. I don’t feel that things like stealth and perception should be a DM-May-I at every step procedure. I think DMs should have power. I have DMed. </span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000"></span></span></p><p><span style="font-family: 'Calibri'"><span style="color: #000000">That being said for everyone that talks about players that can abuse the system (note: I don’t consider powergaming abuse) there are equally as bad DMs that without constraints make the game not fun for their players and campaigns fall apart because of it. Power playing is not an issue; people being disruptive and taking away the enjoyment of others is the issue. When a group has a disruptive player (and by the way I have encountered "deep" role-players whose brand of amateur thespianism disrupted more meet-ups and games than power players I have encountered) be it a powergamer, deep role-player, or whatever the group can just expel that person and move on. When the group has a problematic or overbearing GM that particularly game/campaign is done. So having clarity of procedures in rules does not take away a DM's authority. What it does is clarify applications so everyone knows where they stand and what the baseline says you can or can't do. The GM is still free to change it as she or he sees fit but at least a precedent will have been established. </span></span></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fallstorm, post: 7759520, member: 55683"] [FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]I started D&D in 2E and played every edition since. 4 is my favorite but I like 5E two and I currently am playing in my second 5E campaign. I have DMed but mostly I have been a player. While I like 5E I (along with most of my group) are rather disappointed at the pace of rules production released in 5E. Mike Mearls mentioned that thereis a ton of new players and someone in this over twenty page thread made a statement saying that since 5E is doing so well it must mean that players in general don’t favor heavy rules customization. I take issue with that belief. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]I take issue with it because we really don’t fully know what Hasbro is counting as sales of D&D. Mike Mearls has said before that they don’t have to put out as many splat books because they can release games like Lords of Waterdeep, etcetera as income generators since the Hasbro merger. I am wondering if things like the numerous board games and additional niche products (Dice sets), etcetera are what is making a more significant portion D&D 5E sales now, whereas the RPG books like splat books were the main revenue generator in previous editions? [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]I don’t know if there are any hard numbers on this (perhaps [MENTION=1]Morrus[/MENTION] has some insight) but I would feel secure betting that besides the three core books (DMG, PHB, and MM) the biggest book sales of D&D 5E are probably the books that offer actual rules and option expansions like Xanathar’s Guide to Everything and Mordenkainen’s Guide, and also the SCAG (as the first book to really offer PC expansions despite how skimpy). I do know that there are a number of third party options but many people don’t use those because they like to use official products for a variety of reasons: 1) It creates consistency from campaign to campaign and between games 2) people may feel that official splat material has been better play tested, etc. What I think is that is that Mike Mearl’s statement is coming from two places. 1) His own personal philosophy and not that of ALL the designers because I know Jeremy Crawford had written much more crunch to the game that was not included and 2) it was pragmatic political statement. What I mean in regards to the latter is that WOTC only has a handful of game designers compared to the 3E and even early 4E days. It takes a lot to write a book especially a rulebook and with such a small team the pace of production is inevitably going to be impacted. Now, granted I think they can go a little faster (no psionic expansion yet, slow updates on pre-existing game worlds and so forth) but the fact is unless they work around the clock 24/7 they can only do so much—designers have to eat and sleep too. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]All that being said again I don’t HATE 5E. Also, I think people being somewhat hyperbolic when they talk about the game being "DM Facing". In 90% of my games I am a player. In 5E my character feels very heroic andempowered. In fact, if the game is played correctly where people the DM is doing level appropriate encounters, PCs are working together, I feel like more of an action hero than I did in 3E (although not as much as in 4E) but still I don’t feel cheated in any way. Likewise while I absolutely crave more rules I do think that there is a sufficient level of crunch in the game between (PHB,Xanathar’s, SCAG, and Mordenkainen’s) there are number of classes, subclasses,races, backgrounds, feats, and even optional rules like downtime activity to play with an interesting number of combinations. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]Where I think WOTC (Hasbro) maybe harming themselves is that they are losing money on not producing splat material. I am by no means a rich person and what money I have I work hard for. That being said even when D&D is producing volumes of splat materialparticularly in the 2E and 3E days it is a fact that D&D is a VERY economical hobby compared to most other hobbies. Even if 5E came out with a $50 dollar rulebook every month that is PEANUTS compared to golf, poker, attending a sporting event even nosebleed seats, or simply going to a night club and having a few drinks. D&D is still cheaper. I don’t’ play video games but from what I have seen D&D would still not equal the money most avid video gamers spend on their hobby. None of these things I do so I am okay spending my recreation money that I work hard for on a fairly cheap hobby that I enjoy. The problem is with 5E they give very little to spend money on. With 4E and 3.5 even the DM geared material had stuff in it like a bunch of feats,prestige classes/paragon paths/epic destinies geared towards players so I (and my friends) would purchase those books every month. Assuming they came out with just one $40 dollar book a month that is $480 off one person (and I know I spent more than that because 3.5 was sometimes producing more than one splat amonth). On 5E I have spent probablyabout $400 (the total of all my books combined including core) since 2014 when it was released. I don't buy the adventure books and nor does my group. I don't buy them because I don't DM that often and my current DM write most of their own adventures. So despite what Mearls said I think they are losing opportunities by ignoring CharOps people. [/COLOR][/FONT][FONT=Calibri][COLOR=#000000]The one area where I do think 5E should improve and that they can control but evidently is against design philosophy is in rules clarity. Again, I think 5E is okay from a tactical and combat perspective (I would like to see more tactical options added but I digress) and my character feels powerful enough. It is outside of combat with using abilities and rules that is the issue. I don’t feel that things like stealth and perception should be a DM-May-I at every step procedure. I think DMs should have power. I have DMed. That being said for everyone that talks about players that can abuse the system (note: I don’t consider powergaming abuse) there are equally as bad DMs that without constraints make the game not fun for their players and campaigns fall apart because of it. Power playing is not an issue; people being disruptive and taking away the enjoyment of others is the issue. When a group has a disruptive player (and by the way I have encountered "deep" role-players whose brand of amateur thespianism disrupted more meet-ups and games than power players I have encountered) be it a powergamer, deep role-player, or whatever the group can just expel that person and move on. When the group has a problematic or overbearing GM that particularly game/campaign is done. So having clarity of procedures in rules does not take away a DM's authority. What it does is clarify applications so everyone knows where they stand and what the baseline says you can or can't do. The GM is still free to change it as she or he sees fit but at least a precedent will have been established. [/COLOR][/FONT] [/QUOTE]
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