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Message: <blockquote data-quote="UngeheuerLich" data-source="post: 5566126" data-attributes="member: 59057">@<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=27160" target="_blank">Balesir</a> I am not sure where you got the impression, that i believein badwrong fun...i am explicitely including 3e and 4e in my post to make sure noone reads it as a rant against a particular edition.I am just stating, that in my observations as a DM, mathematically not so fokussed people and people that are not so fit in the rules system more often base their decisions on the world around them, and actually pay more attention.If I am busy, calculating my chances as DM, i am not so aware of what is happening, and I catch myself making irrational decisions...I also want to mention, that powers that allow the interaction with allies, flanking, and powers that allow combos, are also a huge fun factor for me. The best way to design a game is making it simple and efficient. The thing why I chose D&D ove different role playing systems.But, and now I am ranting a bit, the entry level of some classes is quite high... actually the entry level of all PHB1 classes is quite high. So a new player is distracted by a lot of the rules. The PHB fighter is a beutiful piece of design. Not too hard to get a grasp of for a player that does play a lot of RPGs, but the slayer in its simplicity and for the sake of the topic, the thief of ADnD in my case allows and encourages players to think about the world, and how you can help the party with your very limited means...Forever Slayer mentioned the saving grace for the Thief (and the bard), that you increase in levels a lot faster than most classes. In my opinion it has always been a feature, that you start simple and get better later on without too many choices at the start of your career.4e (my edition of choice) would be an even better edition, if you didn´t have to pick a feat at level 1, only a single power and progress to level 2 very soon, where you get most of the other features you get now.Simplicity and some inability at the starting level teaches your players how to interact with the given surrounding and situation...</blockquote>

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