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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 5575947" data-attributes="member: 48965">Hoestly...I'm not sure what you mean here. Instead of parsing a single sentence out of a comment by Balesir, why not just state simply and concisely why you don't think the reward rules support gamism?  First, I never said 4e was at odds with your playstyle... but I don't think it was designed with your playstyle as it's primary goal either. Again I think you are inferring your own take from what is in these books... The issue, IMO, is that Heroquest gives you specific mechanics to enforce it's pacing advice (Level of difficulty is directly dependant upon how well or bad your party has already done) and thematic concerns (You are literally limitless in creating any character as long as it is genre appropriate... 4e doesn't.... DC is based on level not story concerns...character creation is limited to the available combat builds/roles that have been developed, and so on.  Combat is definitely not all of the game, but we were talking about whether there were sub-optimal choices in game... the Ranger, does better damage than the Warlock and gets more skills than the Warlock... so again the Warlock seems a sub-optimal choice for in combat and outside combat as well when compared to the ranger.  I think this speaks to a bigger issue I have with your ideas on 4e... they tend not to be supported in actual implementation of the game by the actual designers. Do majority of the modules from WotC center around "conflict-via-combat driven thematic play, using traditional fantasy tropes" or do they center around gamist challenge based play? I would argue it is gamist challenge based play.  Yes the DM's chosen method of designing encounters does have a big impact on the play of the game... like every edition of D&D. Where we disagree is that, IMO, the rules do stress building encounters as tests of tactics for the players. For the most part the DMG doesn't talk about designing an encounter in a thematic way it talks about designing it with the synergies of roles and monster powers in mind. So no... while it won't push against what you are doing, since you can select thematic monsters for your encounters with the appropriate roles and powers... 4e doesn't necessarily promote that particular playstyle over challenge based either, at least (IMO) no more than any other edition of D&D.</blockquote>

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