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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 4806554" data-attributes="member: 2011">The point was not that the Halfling's move had changed. It was how much it changed. It went beyond just an adjustment and into the realm of this is a different type of creature. Fast.Yes, in 2E movement was 6 for the small races and 12 for the medium.In 3E, that went to 20 for the small races and 30 for the medium. Yes it was a change, but small races were still considerably slower than medium races. They still felt like small races.In 4E, every PC race except Dwarves/Gnomes (speed 5) and Elves (speed 7) are now the same speed 6.Halflings which are a small race are now as fast as the medium races. So, they don't feel as much like a small race. Yup, they have weapon restrictions, but it is still a flavor thing as much as a crunch thing.I agree with the multiclassing changes. Any race can be any class was a new fluff/crunch change of 3E. Level restrictions? Bah. Very few people paid attention to those anyway.But 4E is replete with fluff changes (although some people might see some of these as crunch, I see them as fluff, or fluff and crunch). As examples:Eladrin were celestials in 3E. Now, they are Elves.Succubus were demons in 3E. Now, they are Devils.There are virtually no monsters that default to good.The entire extraplanar cosmos has changed.Healing is not limited to magic.The points of light default.No long duration spells (like buffing for the day, etc.).Implements for spell casting.An increase in the focus of required treasure (this could be mitigated with spells in 3E).Per day abilities for martial classes (which seems nonsensical).Martial PCs have spells (that's what powers really are, e.g. Fighters can do damage when missing).Dragonborn, Eladrin and Tieflings as core races (Who had these races as PCs in most of their games pre-4E? Some, maybe. Total flavor change in the game).Warlocks and Warlords as core classes.No real companions or pets.No real summoned creatures.Semi-wonky illusions (take Phantom Legion, a 22nd level set of illusory guys that can be destroyed by a single foe walking through them)No (real) flying Wizards.The total revamp of the Forgotten Realms (have you even looked at the map, there is no detail in it, just a bunch of holes in the world, and the changes go drastically beyond what the Time of Troubles did).Alignment is totally watered down and does not integrate with spells.Many spells are rituals and cannot be cast in combat.Some PCs can teleport right and left at first level.Conditions right and left in combat.Gain a new utility spell every 5 levels (nearly all magic is attack spells, combat is rarely about neat ways to cast non-offensive spells).None of these are really a response to the in game problems encountered in DND, so they are fluff changes as much as they are crunch changes and often even moreso.The entire model changed. Not just a little here and there like 1E to 2E or 2E to 3E, but the entire game is different. It's doesn't feel as much like Sword and Sorcery anymore (earlier editions even talked about being Sword and Sorcery). It's more like low powered superheroes when Fighters can buff their allies, martial Warlords can heal and PCs can heal themselves.Now, this isn't a gripe about 4E. I play 4E and enjoy it. But, it is pulling the default flavor of DND into a totally different feeling game system. All previous versions of DND, regardless of rules changes, felt like DND. 4E does not. It feels like DND as much as GURP or HARP or Fantasy Hero does. YMMV.</blockquote>

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