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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ashrym" data-source="post: 7958423" data-attributes="member: 6750235">The only reason I play sorcerers at all is for meta-magic.  I'm not inclined to give that to another class in a similar format either.  I don't mind wizard traditions gaining meta-magic types of abilities related to their school, however; a few of those exist and aren't really a concern.I like to nova once in a while but we typically play longer days and that's not really common.  I don't need to spam meta-magic to make it meaningful.  I use meta-magic when it matters in important fights and often conserve it.The extension spells in 1e and 2e were spells that targeted other spells.  That's like calling counterspell or dispel magic meta-magic.  Those spells were cast on a subsequent round if by the same caster using actions and prepared spells.  They didn't even need to be cast by the same magic-user, however, and a different caster could extend someone's spell.I would have a hard time calling that meta-magic in the 3e terms, where it was available to all classes and specifically modified a spell as it was being cast.We don't play "The Dark Crystal".  We play "Dungeons and Dragons".  Taking inspiration from pop culture is fine but it conforms to D&D, and not vice-versa.Vancian casting is not the same as the books from which it originates either but we don't use that to justify changing classes either, and that's a more relevant association.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />I am also old.  I remember when the movie was new, but read the book first.That's because it's how the classes are described.  Magic isn't science but INT based wizards are studying magical theory while CHA based sorcerers are born into bloodlines of magic.Lol, awesome by not having meta-magic, flexible casting, arcane recovery, a ritual book and limited access to the list of spells only available at higher levels?Bards are weaker casters than either, and mage armor and shield or absorb elements tends to make sorcerers and wizards less squishy than light armor and heroism.Bards have better skill and ability checks.  Bardic inspiration is useful.  They are significantly weaker spell casters.</blockquote>

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