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<blockquote data-quote="Hypersmurf" data-source="post: 1386435" data-attributes="member: 1656">That's right.A Twinned Burning Hands deals 5d4 damage, and another 5d4 damage.Empower multiplies all variable numeric effects of the spell by 1.5.So if I Empower a Twinned Burning Hands, I multiply all variable numeric effects - 5d4, and another 5d4 - by 1.5.Because they become effects of the spell that you're duplicating.&nbsp;&nbsp;The phrase &quot;original spell&quot; only crops up in Repeat Spell, doesn't it?&nbsp; (I'm away from my Tome and Blood.)A spell goes off, and then another spell goes off.&nbsp; The second spell is related&nbsp;to &quot;the original spell&quot;.&nbsp; To me, it's obvious that that refers to the spell that originally resolved the round before.&nbsp; A cylindrical Burning Hands, for example.I merely used your own words.&nbsp; What are the &quot;lot of assumptions&quot; I'm making?&nbsp; My assumption is that Metamagic feats act as written.&nbsp; That makes Maximize plus Empower a special case, since no other feats have any statement that suggests they fail to interact with others, nor is there any general rule that makes such a specification.&nbsp; The only reason Maximize and Empower require such a note is to distinguish them from the general case; if the general case prohibited such interaction, the note would be unnecessary.&nbsp;The complete absence of any suggestion anywhere in the rules that the specific case is intended to be generalised?&nbsp;How?&nbsp; Where?&nbsp; Why?&nbsp; Refer back to the hypothetical and fictitious Silent + Sonic Substitution case.&nbsp; How would that case be different to the existing Empower + Maximize case?Your interpretation requires that every Metamagic feat be given an &quot;interacts&quot; or &quot;doesn't interact&quot; designator.Extend interacts.&nbsp; Repeat doesn't interact.An Extended Fire-Substituted Ice Storm gives two full rounds of fire and bludgeoning damage.&nbsp; A Repeated Fire-Substituted Ice Storm gives one full round of fire and bludgeoning damage, and one full round of cold and bludgeoning damage.Why should the feat that makes Ice Storm last twice as long yield a completely different result to a feat that makes Ice Storm happen twice, when the only documented rule for metamagic failing to interact is Maximize and Empower?-Hyp.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hypersmurf, post: 1386435, member: 1656"] That's right. A Twinned Burning Hands deals 5d4 damage, and another 5d4 damage. Empower multiplies all variable numeric effects of the spell by 1.5. So if I Empower a Twinned Burning Hands, I multiply all variable numeric effects - 5d4, and another 5d4 - by 1.5. Because they become effects of the spell that you're duplicating. The phrase "original spell" only crops up in Repeat Spell, doesn't it? (I'm away from my Tome and Blood.) A spell goes off, and then another spell goes off. The second spell is related to "the original spell". To me, it's obvious that that refers to the spell that originally resolved the round before. A cylindrical Burning Hands, for example. I merely used your own words. What are the "lot of assumptions" I'm making? My assumption is that Metamagic feats act as written. That makes Maximize plus Empower a special case, since no other feats have any statement that suggests they fail to interact with others, nor is there any general rule that makes such a specification. The only reason Maximize and Empower [i]require[/i] such a note is to distinguish them from the general case; if the general case prohibited such interaction, the note would be unnecessary. The complete absence of any suggestion anywhere in the rules that the specific case is intended to be generalised? How? Where? Why? Refer back to the hypothetical and fictitious Silent + Sonic Substitution case. How would that case be different to the existing Empower + Maximize case? Your interpretation requires that every Metamagic feat be given an "interacts" or "doesn't interact" designator. Extend interacts. Repeat doesn't interact. An Extended Fire-Substituted Ice Storm gives two full rounds of fire and bludgeoning damage. A Repeated Fire-Substituted Ice Storm gives one full round of fire and bludgeoning damage, and one full round of cold and bludgeoning damage. Why should the feat that makes Ice Storm last twice as long yield a completely different result to a feat that makes Ice Storm happen twice, when the only documented rule for metamagic failing to interact is Maximize and Empower? -Hyp. [/QUOTE]

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