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<blockquote data-quote="Caliban" data-source="post: 1388511" data-attributes="member: 284">I think you mean &quot;it could be cast twice as 2 5th level spells.&quot;&nbsp;I don't think that is the proper way of calculating the cost. The +4 levels for Twin is to get an extra spell in the same round. If you cast it as two 5th lvl spells (two seperate Empowered Fireballs) you are getting two spells in two seperate rounds without using Twin spell. It's not really equivalent.&nbsp;The close equivalent would using a Quickened Empowered spell and an Empowered spell in the same round (something only a wizard can do). The cost there would be a 9th level spell slot and a 5th level spell slot if you were casting a 3rd level spell. &nbsp;See the difference? Using Hyp's way you get the equivalent of an extra 5th level spell slot for free, as compared to the way I believe it's supposed to work. &nbsp;The area of effect would be that of the base spell before it was shaped. In some circumstances that would be a good thing, in others it wouldn't be. &nbsp;I happen to think there is an issue with it making certain feat combinations to powerful (primarily Twin and Repeat), but you are only going to see those come into play at very high levels so it's hard to tell for sure.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Caliban, post: 1388511, member: 284"] I think you mean "it could be cast twice as 2 5th level spells." I don't think that is the proper way of calculating the cost. The +4 levels for Twin is to get an extra spell in the same round. If you cast it as two 5th lvl spells (two seperate Empowered Fireballs) you are getting two spells in two seperate rounds without using Twin spell. It's not really equivalent. The close equivalent would using a Quickened Empowered spell and an Empowered spell in the same round (something only a wizard can do). The cost there would be a 9th level spell slot and a 5th level spell slot if you were casting a 3rd level spell. See the difference? Using Hyp's way you get the equivalent of an extra 5th level spell slot for free, as compared to the way I believe it's supposed to work. The area of effect would be that of the base spell before it was shaped. In some circumstances that would be a good thing, in others it wouldn't be. I happen to think there is an issue with it making certain feat combinations to powerful (primarily Twin and Repeat), but you are only going to see those come into play at very high levels so it's hard to tell for sure. [/QUOTE]

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