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Message: <blockquote data-quote="UngainlyTitan" data-source="post: 9712990" data-attributes="member: 28487">Yes, it is gamist and some examples I know about have being playing rpgs for 40 years. They have had plenty of time to become "enfranchised" they are just not that interested. They would probably be just as happy playing Gloomhaven or a coop online rpg.Another gamist is about "winning D&D", they want to beat the encounters. Not super into rp. They think they are good at optimisation, but only in big numbers go up. They love 3e and Pathfinder because they prebuild their character but did not like 4e.And probably would not like a game like Daggerheart. Too many decisions at the table and not enough in the character build.This gets to the heart of my gripes with the Forge. At best the GNS are axes of a scatter plot with each player a point of in 3d space with some g, some n and some s.The agendas of play oversimplifies and obscures that most people come at the thing with multiple of agendas in mind and may actually respond to different rules systems with different agenda priorities.</blockquote>