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<blockquote data-quote="jmucchiello" data-source="post: 1692560" data-attributes="member: 813">This is close. True min/maxing usually involves numeric analysis. The true min/max fighter has a spreadsheet that tells him the optimal amount to Power Attack by based on hitting the monster with a strike that hits AC 20. (&quot;What? You hit an AC 20? Ooooo, I can PA another +2.&quot;).Right, this is a social thing.My take on munchkinism isn't that they want it all. It's that they want to tell you how they got it. They are the folks that will tell you how they killed a god (usually Thor) with their 43rd level rogue/barbarian/fighter/sorcerer/assassin/blackguard/loremaster. Munchkins delight in telling others about their +16 worldbreaker slingshot, about the time they killed Death, about the time they put out the fires of hell. Yes, definitely in their own league, and definitely require a munchkin DM for best effect. Again, they are a social problem because they make you scared that you should be impressed by what there saying or they might react badly.Min/Maxing isn't necessary unsocial. It's gamist and very unnarrative (in the gamist, narrativist, simulationist triumverate). The social problem with min/maxing is the narrativists who look down upon it. (That is until you become a powergamer doing it. Party: &quot;Let's see if the rogue can pick this lock.&quot; PG:&quot;Why bother, I can do it with this spell...&quot; Party:&quot;Let's see if the burly fighter can bash the door down.&quot; PG:&quot;I have a chime of opening!&quot;)These are of course my own definitions and I think we've established correctly that they vary greatly.</blockquote>[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE="jmucchiello, post: 1692560, member: 813"] This is close. True min/maxing usually involves numeric analysis. The true min/max fighter has a spreadsheet that tells him the optimal amount to Power Attack by based on hitting the monster with a strike that hits AC 20. ("What? You hit an AC 20? Ooooo, I can PA another +2."). Right, this is a social thing. My take on munchkinism isn't that they want it all. It's that they want to tell you how they got it. They are the folks that will tell you how they killed a god (usually Thor) with their 43rd level rogue/barbarian/fighter/sorcerer/assassin/blackguard/loremaster. Munchkins delight in telling others about their +16 worldbreaker slingshot, about the time they killed Death, about the time they put out the fires of hell. Yes, definitely in their own league, and definitely require a munchkin DM for best effect. Again, they are a social problem because they make you scared that you should be impressed by what there saying or they might react badly. Min/Maxing isn't necessary unsocial. It's gamist and very unnarrative (in the gamist, narrativist, simulationist triumverate). The social problem with min/maxing is the narrativists who look down upon it. (That is until you become a powergamer doing it. Party: "Let's see if the rogue can pick this lock." PG:"Why bother, I can do it with this spell..." Party:"Let's see if the burly fighter can bash the door down." PG:"I have a chime of opening!") These are of course my own definitions and I think we've established correctly that they vary greatly.[/QUOTE] [/QUOTE]

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