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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
Min/Maxing in 4e
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<blockquote data-quote="Thasmodious" data-source="post: 4287620" data-attributes="member: 63272"><p>First, the cascade of blades thing is one of those ridiculous examples of theoretically broken, but not game broken. In a normal group, in normal gameplay, you don't hit defenses of your same leveled opponents on a 2+ while packing 4 rerolls to hit a near infinite loop that stretches every sense of the common variety. To even make such a thing possible requires the resources of several party members and building an entire party around getting that one power to novabomb. In a normal game, the power will play fine and good tactics will be for the team to try and buff the ranger a bit so he has a better chance to get a few more attacks in. But engineering a specific situation where the ranger his same leveled opponent's AC defense on a 2+ requires a ridiculous amount of min/maxing that the system nor basic gameplay lends itself at all to. Min/maxing just to pull of a cascade bomb would leave the whole party gimped for every other encounter of the day. But hey, if you are playing in that kind of game anyway, I'm sure you can revive the 15 minute adventuring day. </p><p></p><p>Second, this belief in the 3 dump stat myth is something that has already been dispelled and really needs to be buried and forgotten. Go ahead and play your fighter with an 8 Con, Int, and Cha and bask in the mockery of your DM and fellow players as your "uber fighter" gets taken down in two hits every fight and is the one begging for extended rests because he has too few hit points and 3+ less heal surges than a normal fighter. Or waste two of your feats on toughness and durable just to try and be as good a defender as a fighter built by a new player. Well, I guess its not so much of a waste of feats, since your crappy scores leave you with a much more limited feat selection. All that min/maxing over just your defenses leaves you with a +1 or +2 at most to a defense over what the non min/maxed character would have, and leaves you terribly gimped in many other areas.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Thasmodious, post: 4287620, member: 63272"] First, the cascade of blades thing is one of those ridiculous examples of theoretically broken, but not game broken. In a normal group, in normal gameplay, you don't hit defenses of your same leveled opponents on a 2+ while packing 4 rerolls to hit a near infinite loop that stretches every sense of the common variety. To even make such a thing possible requires the resources of several party members and building an entire party around getting that one power to novabomb. In a normal game, the power will play fine and good tactics will be for the team to try and buff the ranger a bit so he has a better chance to get a few more attacks in. But engineering a specific situation where the ranger his same leveled opponent's AC defense on a 2+ requires a ridiculous amount of min/maxing that the system nor basic gameplay lends itself at all to. Min/maxing just to pull of a cascade bomb would leave the whole party gimped for every other encounter of the day. But hey, if you are playing in that kind of game anyway, I'm sure you can revive the 15 minute adventuring day. Second, this belief in the 3 dump stat myth is something that has already been dispelled and really needs to be buried and forgotten. Go ahead and play your fighter with an 8 Con, Int, and Cha and bask in the mockery of your DM and fellow players as your "uber fighter" gets taken down in two hits every fight and is the one begging for extended rests because he has too few hit points and 3+ less heal surges than a normal fighter. Or waste two of your feats on toughness and durable just to try and be as good a defender as a fighter built by a new player. Well, I guess its not so much of a waste of feats, since your crappy scores leave you with a much more limited feat selection. All that min/maxing over just your defenses leaves you with a +1 or +2 at most to a defense over what the non min/maxed character would have, and leaves you terribly gimped in many other areas. [/QUOTE]
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