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<blockquote data-quote="iserith" data-source="post: 7496007" data-attributes="member: 97077">I was talking about this with someone else in Discord and one thing I noticed is that since his games don't usually include Bad Stuff happening on a failed check, the players are more than happy to want to roll. In my game, when I ask for a roll, the players sort of go &quot;Oh. Crap.&quot; And then they start spending resources to mitigate the chance of failure, typically Inspiration. That isn't always the case because the stakes can vary greatly depending on the scene, but perhaps focusing on the meaningful consequence of failure - the existence of which is required to even ask for an ability check in the first place - might be a way to curb this behavior. If failure on a roll is going to sting, the impetus to roll may be reduced.The other thing I've found is I explain to my players that rolling a d20 should be the LAST thing they want to do. Given half a chance, the fickle d20 will kill them and everyone they've ever loved. It should be avoided as much as possible. Once they internalize that, I find that players never ask to make rolls again and dread the moments when they need to. If Pathfinder is anything like D&amp;D 3e, then the expectation is that players will ask to make or declare that they are making &quot;skill checks.&quot; That is not the paradigm in D&amp;D 5e and that's just something they're going to need to adapt to. D&amp;D 5e is not a software upgrade on previous editions. It is a different game altogether with different assumptions that demand approaches that may not apply in other games. Only open communication on this issue will do anything in my experience.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="iserith, post: 7496007, member: 97077"] I was talking about this with someone else in Discord and one thing I noticed is that since his games don't usually include Bad Stuff happening on a failed check, the players are more than happy to want to roll. In my game, when I ask for a roll, the players sort of go "Oh. Crap." And then they start spending resources to mitigate the chance of failure, typically Inspiration. That isn't always the case because the stakes can vary greatly depending on the scene, but perhaps focusing on the meaningful consequence of failure - the existence of which is required to even ask for an ability check in the first place - might be a way to curb this behavior. If failure on a roll is going to sting, the impetus to roll may be reduced. The other thing I've found is I explain to my players that rolling a d20 should be the LAST thing they want to do. Given half a chance, the fickle d20 will kill them and everyone they've ever loved. It should be avoided as much as possible. Once they internalize that, I find that players never ask to make rolls again and dread the moments when they need to. If Pathfinder is anything like D&D 3e, then the expectation is that players will ask to make or declare that they are making "skill checks." That is not the paradigm in D&D 5e and that's just something they're going to need to adapt to. D&D 5e is not a software upgrade on previous editions. It is a different game altogether with different assumptions that demand approaches that may not apply in other games. Only open communication on this issue will do anything in my experience. [/QUOTE]

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