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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Descended" data-source="post: 5223436" data-attributes="member: 91767">I don't have MM3 yet, so I'm assuming from what has been posted prior that you expect the unconsciousness effect to hit at least twice if you have two monsters using the power.Why not approach this from a fun role playing perspective rather than a kill-the-PCs perspective?As subterfuge oriented monsters, they will not attack until they expect to easily kill the party. Any combat that happens completely on their terms should be expected to TPK, or at least come close.The PCs have already failed their save or die roll when they failed the critical Insight roll(s).  Now, its up to the DM to either let things take their obvious course and kill some or all of the PCs or to have the story take an interesting turn and give the PCs the upper hand again.If you allow the PCs to discover the jackalweres before they have sprung their surprise, then the jackalweres will fight to survive rather than destroy.  A monster fighting to survive is going to use their unconsciousness attack, and then use the next standard action to further their chance of survival by running away or attacking a PC who is preventing them from escaping.  A monster that feels it has the upper hand or has serious bloodthirst issues is the monster thats going to blow a standard action to kill a unconscious opponent.If you are set on having the seriously threatening form of the fight, you could set it up having the PCs discover a Deceiver and one or two other weres, and then have the Deceiver use its unconsciousness attack and run away, and return later with a full compliment of friends.  At least then the PCs are mechanically informed of the risks, and its up to them to handle the situation as well as they can.</blockquote>

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